The Dark Side Of Kale (And How To Eat Around It)



The headline in The New York Times made my heart sink: “Kale? Juicing? Trouble Ahead.

Confession: I’m one of those Vitamix-loving, green-smoothie worshipping, kale bandwagoners. I brim with holier-than-thou pride when my kids eat raw kale (no dressing, even!) and thick kale-laden shakes while other children snack on sugary GoGURT squeezes and suck on juice boxes.

I am not alone. Presidents and stars are kale-lovers too.

Kale, in case you haven’t noticed, is health-conscious America’s “it” vegetable. Raw, blended, sauteed or in chip or “crunch” form, it appears to be the manna of celebrities: Gwyneth and Jennifer devour it while Kevin Bacon recently declared [it's] “the age of kale.” In an astutely reported feature called “Stars Who Love Kale,” US Weekly quotes Bette Midler saying: “Kale is burning up the veggisphere.”

Even the Obamas dined on kale salad at their Thanksgiving feast, notes The Washington Post.

But apparently there’s trouble in cruciferous paradise.

Writing for The Times, Jennifer Berman reports on the dark side of kale, and how the health-infused, veggie Eden she’d carefully built over years began to crumble:

Imagine my shock, then, at my last physical, when my doctor told me I had hypothyroidism, common in women over 40. When I got home I looked up the condition on the Internet and found a list of foods to avoid. Kale, which I juiced every morning, tops the list, followed by broccoli, cauliflower, cabbage, Brussels sprouts and collard greens — the cruciferous vegetables I consumed in large quantities because they are thought to prevent cancer, which runs in my family. And flax — as in the seeds — high in omega 3’s, that I sprinkled on cereal and blended in strawberry almond milk smoothies. Also forbidden: almonds and strawberries, not to mention soy, peaches, peanuts, corn, radishes, rutabaga and spinach.

My first reaction: Berman must be misguided, mistaken. Can kale possibly be bad?

Well, yes, possibly. Here’s the science-y lowdown on the kale-thyroid connection from the Oregon State University Micronutrient Information site:

Very high intakes of cruciferous vegetables…have been found to cause hypothyroidism (insufficient thyroid hormone) in animals (68). There has been one case report of an 88-year-old woman developing severe hypothyroidism and coma following consumption of an estimated 1.0 to 1.5 kg/day of raw bok choy for several months. Two mechanisms have been identified to explain this effect. The hydrolysis of some glucosinolates found in cruciferous vegetables (e.g., progoitrin) may yield a compound known as goitrin, which has been found to interfere with thyroid hormone synthesis. The hydrolysis of another class of glucosinolates, known as indole glucosinolates, results in the release of thiocyanate ions, which can compete with iodine for uptake by the thyroid gland. Increased exposure to thiocyanate ions from cruciferous vegetable consumption or, more commonly, from cigarette smoking, does not appear to increase the risk of hypothyroidism unless accompanied by iodine deficiency. One study in humans found that the consumption of 150 g/day (5 oz/day) of cooked Brussels sprouts for four weeks had no adverse effects on thyroid function.

(For an updated reality check on kale consumption and the thyroid, see our Q and A with endocrinologist and thyroid expert Dr. Jeffrey Garber here. Bottom line: in the U.S, where we don’t have a big problem with iodine deficiency, it’s probably OK.)

Teresa Fung, Sc.D., M.S.. an adjunct professor of nutrition at the Harvard School of Public Health and a professor at Simmons College in Boston, confirms the kale-thyroid link. But, she says, “normal, reasonable amounts of eating should not be a problem. A regular person [with no thyroid issues] who eats several servings of cruciferous vegetables a week should not have problems.”

Fung adds: “It’s the dose that makes a poison. If people have hypothyroidism or they’re taking thyroid medication, then they should check with their doctor. But even in this case, reasonable amounts shouldn’t be a problem. Now, if people have a tall glass of kale juice every single day, then it gets into the unknown territory.”

So, what are still-anxious kale-lovers to do? I asked Somerville, Mass. health coach and psychology of eating coach Nina Manolson to offer some guidance. (She’s not a doctor, but she knows a lot about food, so keep that in mind and always check with a professional if you make major changes in your diet.)

Nina reiterated that kale is a goitrogenic food, meaning that it can contribute to an enlarged thyroid — a goiter. A goiter indicates that the thyroid gland is not functioning optimally. But, she says, there are ways to have our kale and eat it too. Here, lightly edited, are her suggestions:

1. Cook Your Kale

The goitrogenic properties of kale become dramatically lessened when kale — or any other cruciferous vegetable — is cooked. (Other veggies in this category include: broccoli, brussel sprouts, cabbage, cauliflower, collard greens, kohlrabi, mustard, rutabaga, turnips, bok choy and Chinese cabbage. Arugula, horseradish, radish, wasabi and watercress are also cruciferous vegetables.)

2. Eat Seaweed

Kale on its own does not increase the risk of thyroid problems. It’s a combination of factors; including potential iodine deficiency. (One of the most common causes of goiters is iodine deficiency.) Adding seaweed or another iodine rich food to your diet may, in some cases, help you get adequate iodine.

3. Throw A Brazil Nut Into Your Smoothie

Selenium can support normal iodine levels which in turn may support a healthy thyroid. A Brazil nut or two in your daily smoothie or as a topping to any dish might help keep selenium levels strong.

4. Switch Up Your Greens

Vary your greens. If you’re going to eat kale one day choose a non-cruciferous, non-goitrogenic veggie dish the next, like a simple cucumber and tomato salad, or beets. There are many highly nutritious vegetables that aren’t goitrogenic, including celery, parsley, zucchini, carrots and more. Our bodies need many nutrients and by eating a variety of vegetables you’ll ensure that you don’t overload on one and skip another.

Nina adds:

If you don’t have a thyroid issue, kale can and should be a delicious and healthy part of your diet because it is, indeed, a nutritional superstar with excellent credentials:

•It supports strong bones because of its high calcium content.

•It’s a potential immune booster, rich in Vitamin C.

•It may protect us against cancer because it’s packed with antioxidants and as mentioned, it’s a cruciferous vegetable.

•It’s high in iron which can support blood and energy levels.

•And of course, it’s packed with fiber so it’s great for digestion.

All of this leaves me wishing that eating were just, well, simpler. With no arsenic in the rice and no flip-flopping guidance on milk, soy, whatever, from the experts. It reminds me (and several commenters on The Times’ kale story) of that looming prophet of health, Woody Allen, and this scene from his film, “Sleeper”:

Dr. Melik: This morning for breakfast he requested something called “wheat germ, organic honey and tiger’s milk.”

Dr. Aragon: [chuckling] Oh, yes. Those are the charmed substances that some years ago were thought to contain life-preserving properties.

Dr. Melik: You mean there was no deep fat? No steak or cream pies or… hot fudge?

Dr. Aragon: Those were thought to be unhealthy… precisely the opposite of what we now know to be true.

Dr. Melik: Incredible.

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  • downtown21

    Anyway, the health problems are caused by this ridiculous notion that there’s some kind of “magic food” out there that if you cram yourself with, it will fix all your problems and make you a model of health. The people who fall for this keep lurching from “fad” food to fad food, always thinking the next popular item will be the one despite all the previous fads not working out.

    You were “juicing kale every morning?” Seriously? Think about that. Why would you have so much kale, every day? Kale is good for you, yeah. Lots of things are good for you. So you should work those things into your diet. But why would you take one of those healthy things and obsessively cram it down your throat EVERY SINGLE DAY in huge quantities? Why don’t you just, y’know…HAVE KALE WITH DINNER TONIGHT? And tomorrow you can have a different vegetable with your dinner. And next week you can have kale again. And whatever veggie you’re having with your dinner, it should only be PART of the meal…a BALANCED meal, not just sitting down to a plate loaded with a mountain of just one ingredient.

    • Mia

      The key is to eat a large variety of things in moderation. Have a different green every day of the week and don’t eat more than one or two servings of it.

  • downtown21
  • AnitaC1040

    How interesting this discussion is. I am 60 years old and am on Levothyroxin because I have low thyroid functions. Every women in my family is on this drug, including non related women. Is something going on, that needs to be looked at from the medical community. My 20 year old niece had thyroid cancer a few years ago and had her thyroid removed. On a non related issue, I wonder if maybe I have consumed too many of those cruciferous veggies. I am of Italian extraction and grew up eating those kinds of veggies daily.

  • Lona

    I think this is one of those things were… not enough research has been done to substantiate those claims. If you eat tons and tons of any one thing, there could be an imbalance at some point if you are not eating enough of other needed nutrients. I don’t believe that remaining on drugs is a long term solution to any condition. Food and good balance is the key to optimum health. I think…

  • Fabio Figueredo

    In other words these green veggies diminish the immunologic system.

  • Demetrio Mendoza

    Hi Jennifer, I’m a 45 year old male and concerned that juicing on kale and spinach may raise my blood pressure since if I read right…it can thicken your blood. Is this a valid concern….help

  • TheBride

    OMG, I started eating a ton of kale last month and went wildly into a hypothyroid profile, swollen face, eyes, etc.! THANK YOU for posting this story!

  • djsmith9

    this can be understood in terms of acidity vs. alkalinity diet theory. Good ‘ol Edgar Cayce said that it’s most healthy to “always have a slightly more alkaline diet and you’ll never get a cold if you do” (I’ve followed this for decades and never get sick). Diets high in sweets, pastries, meat, potaties. I.E. standard American diet are highly acidic, which is what causes the cancer. Edgar went on to say that “TOO MUCH alkalinity is even WORSE for you than too much acid”! So the recommendation here for reasonable amounts of kale is spot on. As usual, Americans are now ovrerdoing it the other way – too many greens. You should be good with a reasonable amount of greens, not a boat load. (OR, grandma now says “be sure to eat your sugar and pastries to counteract those greens” :-0).

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  • krscott7

    You cannot get raw see weed / kelp without radiation anywhere. I am having a hard time finding a place to purchase that isn’t processed without too much salt.

  • Sinclair2

    Falls in line with Lee Iacocca describing in his autobiography when as a teenager how Italian immigrants were also made fun of and scoffed at because of their pizza pies.

  • Sinclair2

    I remember years ago when mainstream, middle class Americans scoffed and made fun of people who ate kale. It was a favorite of Portuguese immigrants and their children.

  • Jeff Chapman

    “psychology of eating coach”


  • abcornwell

    Interesting. My husband must not eat kale, spinach, Swiss chard, and a whole lot of other foods (strawberries, blueberries, rhubarb, sweet potatoes, soy products, peanuts, and on and on…) because he chronically forms kidney stones. They are the type of stones which are accelerated by consumption of foods containing oxalate. Previously our diet had been heavy in lots of these foods … a morning smoothie was non-fat soymilk, strawberries, wheat germ … lunch was peanut butter sandwich … dinner included dark greens and maybe a sweet potato. Since he’s adhered rigorously to a low oxalate diet he’s not had a single episode of kidney stones that had him rushing to the ER. (He’s passed some small ones w/o pain.) So, we’ll see how it goes. But he sure does miss spinach salad, and berries!

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  • Juoli

    I read in Wikipedia that celery interacts with levothyroxin. I was diagnosed with hypothyroidism since September 2013 & taking 50mcg every morning with a glass of water on an empty stomach since then. I also have high blood pressure and wanted to try celery juice to ween off the high blood pressure pills until I read Wikipedia. Can you enlightened me with this? of course, I will talk to my physician beforehand, but, when I read this it says that celery isn’t goitrogenic. Please help!!!

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  • Anne Schuette

    I’ve been drinking green smoothies daily since 2008, and I have hypothyroid. One week I’ll drink smoothies with kale, and the next week I drink them with collards. My doses of levothyroxine and armour have not changed one bit in these past 6 years. So in my case, the kale doesn’t seem to be making my hypothyroidism worse. And I have to say – the green smoothies help me in so many other ways – I won’t give them up.

  • DesertGal

    How does this relate to a person who had Graves disease 20 years ago and was cured? I regularly have it tested to be sure I am still OK. I like kale but I can’t eat it uncooked as it is too course. I just steam it before eating it.

  • yvonne

    if you eat kale smoothies and also take throid extract does it stop the medication working? or does kale only affect the thyroid when it has to make its own hormone and you dont take medication

  • Mary

    Hi Jennifer! I am on synthroid then levothyroxine meds for over 25 yrs now with the same mcg cuz 1/3 of one gland was removed due to a small tumor. It was a bengin. My thyroid level is stable for over 25 yrs …Till 3 months ago, I had the routine check up with the dr and the blood work showed that my thyroid level was alert, I was told that it looked like I took the meds too much…no, it is same dose and take one daily but the dr said to stay with it for now till next check up and see… Maybe will adjust the dose…..the dr said I could stop the meds now but afraid I will might gain the the past 8 months, I changed my diet into more health foods and excerises…I eat more kale now than before….Does that change my thyroid function??? Does it improve my thyroids and does not need the meds???

  • Dimitri Ledkovsky

    Everything good in moderation. Kale smoothies daily??? Barf.

  • Uti

    Your doctor is the last person you should ask for nutritional advice considering most doctors have little or no formal nutritional training. In the USA the average lifespan of caucasian physicians is 73.0 years, black physicans 68.7 years, while the average population lifespan is 77.6 years. Bus drivers live longer than doctors.

    • joev

      More stress?

  • Phranqlin

    If a little kale is good for you, a LOT must be better!

    Or not.

  • bapeck5

    I live by two mottos: 1) Eat what you enjoy, just eat in moderation, and 2) Too much of anything (even if it’s a good thing) can become a bad thing.

  • ShermanTMcCoy

    All I know is, since I gave up sugar, white flour, most starches, etc., I feel a WHOLE lot better. Getting the warning from my doctor that I was pre-diabetic got me onto a low carb diet. I eat lots of non-starchy veggies, meats, fats, berries, Greek yoghurt etc., dropped 20 pounds, and got incredibly good (according to my doctor) lipids, and normalized blood sugar. I’ve never had an HDL above 40 and now it’s 60, and the LDL actually DROPPED to 90. The triglycerides are ridiculously low.

    I don’t gorge on cruciferous vegetables every day, but they do make up a good portion of my veggie intake. I am far less worried about kale than am about worthless carbohydrates with no food value.

  • Susan

    I have been on thyroid medication for over 23 years, ever since I was 17. I was never told not to eat certain vegetables or limit the amount of any type of food. The one thing I do know is that I have to wait several hours after taking my medication before I can take or eat anything high in iron as the iron can disrupt the body from absorbing the needed medication. Also, fiber can interfere as well. That could be why too make kale is not a good thing for those of us on medication. Just make sure you eat it for lunch or dinner if you take your medication when you first get up in the morning.

  • Justin

    People should look into Dr Brownstein, Dr Abraham, and Dr Flechas’ work on iodine…. Dr Sircus has, in my opinion, about the best intro articles/coverage on this, but, once you read them, you’ll want to read more… from their opinion, we’re all horribly iodine deficient to begin with… and, not that they ‘knock kale’ but more reveal ‘misperceptions’ in the medical community across the board. Can’t recommend them enough. What I learned truly blew me away… and that usually takes quite a lot

  • Brent Gourley

    1 KG? As in 2.2 Lb? That is a lot of vegetables. Two bunches of kale weighs about 0.8 pounds and that is probable about 3 days worth of vegetables. Too much of anything is bad for you. That holds true for these super foods. Eating a x6-12 dose for years is not recommended. Just like you shouldn’t take 6 multi-vitamins a day.

    Keep eating healthy, but remember to balance your diet. I still eat junk food like ice cream and chips, but just getting those veggies in is very important. Though when my metabolism slows down, I might cut down the junk food even more.

  • Helya Tremblay

    MODERATION in everything is the secret ….. people just don’t get that. Moderation is balance. Going overboard on anything (good or bad) will have consequences. Enjoy variety and live a good life.

  • intuition

    Omgosh, Eat kale dont eat kale. ?.Eat grerns more dont eat to msny greens…thyroid hyper or non…just to many rules guid lines and causes and effects….The food pyramid is suppisefly incorrect after ALL these years and now “studies say”…its all way to complicated. ? If we went strait to tge source, of adding bad preservatives and bann them and Make laws against pesticide use and go 110% organic or nothing at all would sure fux tge many Now issues that stemmed from poor choice of fda allowed recources allowed to aid oyr grocery dtore products, in my eyes FIX MIST AILMENTS and bring simplucity back into our daily luves…Ya think.. huh!!??

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  • Melanie

    Hi I have a huge problem that I hope someone can answer for me. I had hyperthyroidism about 9 yrs ago. I was put on a small dosage, when I got pregnant with my 3rd child and was getting tested every month, my thyroid was back to normal and the doctor took me off the meds.I then had my daughter and a year later had my forth daughter. I started watching my calories and just really looked after myself and lost about 45 pounds which was awesome, because I had such a hard time losing weight after the first two kids and was always staying at the 180 mark grrrrr lol Now in the spring/summer of 2013 I got hurt at work and was home for two weeks and yep gained 5 pounds, then even tho I returned to work, then it was 10 pds and now I am back to 175 GRRRRRRRRR I just don’t understand. I’ve went to the doctor and my thyroid is fine. Now I have been on and off eating flax and now just 2 weeks ago started eating kale. So can kale make me have the thyroid problem again????? I’m just very discouraged. One of the reasons I stared eating kale was my digestive system and I figured going to the bathroom would be alot easier than taking exlax. If anyone has ideas or suggestions or just anything I would greatly, greatly appreciate it…..Thank You for taking the time to read this. Melanie

  • Dav

    Since we need to eat something, you can eat fast food or worry about
    kale, the sugar content in fruit, etc. Honestly, the vast majority of
    Americans would do far better eating 20 apples and a daily kale shake
    then their usual obesity-causing diets which contribute to alarming
    increases in diabetes, high blood pressure, etc. But trans fat and fast
    food is old news and no one reads it any more, so trivial concerns
    about things like kale are now in vogue to report. P-l-e-a-s-e.
    Folks -
    eat up and worry not about your kale, cauliflower, etc.

  • Dav

    Since we need to eat something, you can eat fast food or worry about kale, the sugar content in fruit, etc. Honestly, the vast majority of Americans would do far better eating 20 apples and a daily kale shake then their usual obesity-causing diets which contribute to alarming increases in diabetes, high blood pressure, etc. But trans fat and fast food is old news and no one reads it any more, so trivial concerns about things like kale are now in vogue to report. P-l-e-a-s-e.
    Folks – eat up and worry not about your kale, cauliflower, etc.

  • TruthIsBeauty

    All things in moderation….I have thyroid issues, I take selenium, and don’t limit salt as I also have adrenal fatique. A few years ago, I could not eat a whole bunch of veggies because of blood thinners and managing my Vitamin K levels. So now, I eat them and kale is my new go to veggies, having it raw a couple of times a week. I cook my spinach, but not my kale.

    Recently, I saw that most (90%) of hypothyroidism is caused by autoimmune issues, not iodine deficiency, in the US. Article after article on thyroid talks about deficiency, which is really not an issue in this country with our ready access to iodized salt and seafood. Also there is fluoride in our water which binds to the sites on the thyroid that the iodine needs to bind by. It’s like fluoride has taken up all the parking spaces and the iodine can just drive around the parking lot, hoping someone pulls out.

    I would also say that the sole reliance on lab values for managing hypothyroidism does a grave disservice to people with this issue. The lab reference range is an average ranges amongst healthy individuals. A good doctor managing thyroid should be going by symptoms over the lab values as the best indicator, because the symptoms are a better indicator for bodies that may or may not be in line with ‘average’. I need to be at the lower end of normal to feel good, while some docs will look at my labs and say, oh, we need to lower your dose etc.

    In fact, I recently talked to a doctor that told me that even though I was on replacement, that she would test me and if I was within the reference range that’s been deprecated by a smaller range, she would take me off of thyroid medication entirely. Basically, malpractice to take someone stable under treatment for a condition and remove the treatment, thereby causing illness. She also told me that antibodies have nothing to do with the thyroid. She was going to go only by labs, and ignore the full details of the case as well as new information about management of patients with antibody levels above normal.

    Luckily my current doctor knows me well enough to know that I know the symptoms, I know when things aren’t right, and I can adjust my dose in consultation, and then we follow with blood tests later.

    The bottom line is that when you feel great and normal, that’s where your levels should be. I know the threshold where I start to have symptoms and it’s smack in the middle of the reference range.

  • Ellery

    “All of this leaves me wishing that eating were just, well, simpler.”

    Um…eating is simple. Eat a healthy, varied, well-balanced diet of mostly plants of many different colors. (For help, see Michael Pollan’s “Food Rules.”) Americans so over think all of this…and then do dumb things like eat 2 pounds of nothing but greens a day, or eat nothing but bacon and eggs, or talk about how they eat “just like cavemen used to eat.” Just eat real, non-processed, food. It’s a great way to live.

  • townie1952

    Too much of a good thing can hurt you. moderation in all things, even kale. I tried several recipes using kale and just could not stand the taste of the stuff. I guess I’ll have to get my hypothyroidism some other way

  • Leah Silver Graves

    I loved this post. I currently use raw spinach in my daily green smoothies. (organic) I’ve got one particular person up and arms that I’m not using Kale. I just forwarded this article. Everything in moderation. Even kale!

  • DaveHolden

    Good warning but “very high intakes of…” is the key. Can Americans stop being so idiotic and taking things to extremes?

  • Pennie Rodgers

    Leafy greens also contain high Values of vitamin K which causes your blood to clot. I started eating healthy and all of the kale, and spinach caused a blood clot in my leg and broke off and went to both lungs.

  • BigAl1825

    Look, people, health is simple. Think of what your ancestors were likely eating for thousands of years, and eat that. Northern European? Then dairy is probably OK in moderation. For many other groups, probably not, except in small quantities.

    No group of humans on the planet has ever lived off of copious amounts of pureed cruciferous vegetables. Nothing, in excess, is good for your body, no matter how comparatively good that substance seems in isolation.

    So-called “health” freaks need to stop following every passing fad, and start using common sense.

  • BougieHippie

    In conclusion, don’t eat period…ALL FOODS WILL KILL YOU!

  • Todd Binkley

    Most people with thyroid issues are iodine deficient. Those who won’t eat or can’t find good seaweed (it’s delicious!), should consider supplementing iodine. A great resource for information about iodine deficiency is See also, my blog:

  • chefjamielevine

    It’s a shame that this has gone so viral because people actually seem to believe whatever they read. The last thing the media needs to do is dissuade our country from one of the few trendy foods actually putting us a step in the right direction.

    I wrote more about this here:

  • markodavid

    Normal /reasonable? that is not the american way! americans go from one food tunnel fad to the next as soon as anybody raises a flag. Nutrition is similar to investing,diversify your approach and you can’t go too far wrong.You can also let the experts bang their jaws while you live well without them

  • Carmina McGee

    I am a Registered Dietitian Nutritionist who specializes in working with nuero-endocrine disorders including thyroid. I am also a thyroid patient. There is nothing wrong with eating Kale or the other goitrogenic containing foods listed as long as it is not excessive. Not listed in this group are green tea and soy. Over consumption or frequent consumption is usually the problem. If you are juicing Kale, there is not a lot of juice to be had so it requires using a much larger quantity, creating a high concentration of goitrogenic compounds. In the example of the 88 year old woman, she was eating about 3.5 pounds daily of goitrogen rich food, for months! It was like taking anti-thyroid medication only it came in food form. My advice to my patients is to enjoy all the mentioned foods but in smaller proportion to the non goitrogenic foods. One cup or two of whole Kale, several times per week but not daily – but not 3.5 pounds per day! These foods are all rich in many critical nutrients we need. Soy is the one I suggest for only occasional consumption due to dual pathways interfering with thyroid. There is no magic in just one food so we have to be smart, moderate, eat the whole food instead of just the juice, pay attention to any changes in your body that may signal a thyroid slow-down and get it checked out with your doctor.

  • Sarah Esterman

    This might already be said somewhere int his comment stream, but iodine is not a suggestion for everyone suffering from hypothyroidism. Most cases of hypothyroidism are caused by Hashimoto’s disease (an autoimmune condition in which the immune system attacks the thyroid gland), and extra iodine is a big no-no for people with Hashi’s.

  • Dan

    Kale isn’t the “superfood” that many people believe it to be. It’s just one more ingredient that can be added to a balanced diet.

  • Astrid N.

    If you eat too much of anything it’s bad for you. So, go on and eat your kale, it’s more beneficial for you if you don’t overdo it. Please, don’t let the random nutcase run your life. Thanks. Astrid

  • Grrrlj

    I am 26 years old and have hashimotos hypothyroidism….. and of course, I’m a health nut… or so I thought. I eat a veggie heavy diet including large amounts of kale and other veggies listed. I know hypothyroidism runs in my family. Should I lower my intake of the foods listed above? I am afraid I may be worsening my thyroid as it is not currently “under control”

  • Bob

    So many fail comments. All hail the trite hive-mind.

  • Paul Strauss

    Read the book “Eat Like A Predator, Not Like Prey” and you will understand why none of this surprised me a bit.

  • Dt Bell

    Moderation in all things, You want disappointment? See what people CAN’T have with a latex allergy.

  • Kathi Barry

    The *Dark Side* of Kale :)

  • endus

    Gee, diving headfirst into the latest nutritional fad rather than adding a sensible amount of a healthy food to your diet is bad for you. I can’t believe it.

    The quote at the end of the article is exactly right. It happens over and over again and yet somehow people are still surprised every time it does. Its called moderation. Its not really that sexy, and I don’t think the celebrities are doing it, but its usually a good way to hedge your bets.

    If celebrity endorsements are really the important thing here, maybe we should look at adding gallons of scotch, cigars, and mountains of cocaine to our diets. Has there been a serious study of this potentially life saving diet?

  • mdicarlo

    I guess the best advise of all is: moderation…

  • Andrew Winson

    Kale in large quantities is also a no-no if you’re on warfarin (i.e. Coumadin) blood thinners, since it provides a massive dose of the vitamin K that the warfarin is locking up access to in order to regulate blood clotting.

  • margieR

    Y’all are scary. How did you live this long anyway? between bashing healthy eating and going on uncontrolled rants, I’m surprised no one has had a coronary.

  • stephanie

    High levels of anything could mess you up or put you out of balance! Kale, broccoli and other cruciferious should be part of your diet. Now what is the next healthy thing/fad, avoid green leafy veggies or cruciferious veggies because they may cause hypothyroidism. Maybe you should drink a bunch of smoothies and juices and then will see what happens to the ALC and blood sugar levels. Balanced meals, eating mostly unprocessed foods is the key to a healthy diet. And not eating excessive amounts of calories! PS it is ok to have the occasional chocolate mousse!

  • Leasa Ryan-Janssen

    One word: MODERATION. Geese Louise! MODERATION. No one needs to eat Kale every stinking day.

  • Rob Lewis

    But, but, but…Brazil nuts are radioactive! (It’s true: look it up.)

  • propsguy

    the article in the NYTimes was a joke! it was sarcasm and not even really good sarcasm at that! are we really to believe that her dentist told her she should eat candy?

  • Nono

    I’m glad someone wrote an article about this because I didn’t know that kale could be bad for me. Now I can do some more research and find out what foods I should be eating in better moderation.

    A few years ago, I decided to kick myself in the ass and get fit. I stopped eating anything with high fructose corn syrup in it and tried to keep my sugar intake to less than 25 grams a day. I started running, climbing rope and did push ups whenever I could. I switched out rice for quinoa and started eating a lot of raw kale. I would mix it up with other leafy veggies like sauteed collard greens and brussel sprouts. I even cut out most products with wheat as it makes me bloated.

    After a year and a few months on this diet and 50 lbs lighter, I was told that the right side of my thyroid was enlarged and had to be removed and checked for cancer. Luckily, it wasn’t cancer and the surgery was fairly easy. I was going out with friends the very next day even though my jaw was still a wee bit numb from the novocaine.

    I was mostly eating kale but it looks like most of the vegetables I have been eating are cruciferous vegetables. I’m not vegetarian. I do eat a lot of meat as well. Mostly chicken and salmon and the occasional hamburger. There are probably other factors too but I’m definitely going to do some more research.

    By the way, cucumbers and tomatoes (“vegetables” containing seeds, are technically fruits, are they not?). I also cut out juice and don’t eat many fruits besides berries. Too much sugar, but I’ll always make the exception for scotch.

  • Carol Wain

    Hmm… so for someone with hyperthyroidism and toxic multi-nodular goiter, could eating a LOT of kale slow down my thyroid to “normal” levels?

  • anke kapels

    In the north of Germany cooked kale has a long tradition. It is served with a special sausage, smoked pork chop and special bacon. The “Grünkohlessen” (Kale Dish) is served only during winter, after the kale in the fields got its first bite of frost (which is said to give it a better taste). People join to go for lomg walks (“Grünkohlfahrt” = Kale Tour) with a trolly full of Schnaps they drink during their walk which ends at a restaurant. There they eat a lot of kale stew. At the end the person who has eaten the most kale is crowned “King of Kale” (“Grünkohl-König”). Whenever I tell friends in Germany about eating kale as a salad they burst into laughter because they can’t believe anybody would really want to eat it raw.

  • Carl Donsbach

    So, how much do you have to eat before it loses its beneficial effects and becomes dangerous?

  • Jami Shofner

    So, folks who concentrate on eating an all-natural, organic diet will still die, probably from natural organic causes.

  • Frugalone

    Not a fan of juicing anything. Eating food in its whole state as far as I’m concerned it much better for you. You get the satisfaction of chewing, mixing it with your saliva, and getting the fiber you need.

  • SosaysYou

    Americans have a tendency to go crazy with something. Like soy. In Asia they eat anal amounts of it not soy milk, soy latte, soy as a preservative in ALL their foods like we have here. Jeez butter, real sugar, nitrate free or naturally occurring nitrate bacon and greens , fruit vegetable in and CAKE in.moderation will not kill YOU. But extreme anything, kale everyday likely will.

  • lorennwitherspoon

    This just reinforces the MOTTO, EVERYTHING in MODERATION!!!!

  • Megan Johnson

    hey! my son eats yogurt from a tube and drinks juice from a box..snobbery.

  • Megan Johnson

    hey! my kid eat yogurt in a tube and juice from a box!! snob.

  • Heather Heath

    Although we are all human, we are individuals with varying body types, internal mechanisms and biological systems. It is very difficult to peg one specific food as healthy for all individuals. I have personally found that paying attention to what blood type you are and which internal flora your body possesses can speak volumes to the types of food your body can easily assimilate. I am always skeptical of blanket statements when it comes to nutrition,….or anything for that matter.

  • No6655321

    You don’t need the response article. It’s Jennifer Berman’s ONLY article with NYTimes…. and based on nothing. Her doctor diagnosed her. No professional said it was from kale. She looked ONLINE to find that it was one of the things that can cause this along with other types of certain plans… if eaten in mass quantities over time.
    Non-story on her part. Baseless. Reactionary.

  • Kelly2

    Apart from thyroid issues, drinking a huge glass of kale juice every day could possibly earn you a trip to the hospital with a DVT that could become a pulmonary embolism. This is a potentially fatal condition and is no joking matter. If anyone in your family has a history of blood clots, please do not consume huge amounts of vegetables rich in Vitamin K (particularly if you take estrogen products such as oral contraceptives).

    Here’s a pretty good summary of the hypercoagulable conditions:

    Moderation is key. Please be sensible. I am a physician, but by all means don’t take the word of a stranger on the internet. Consult your doctor.

  • Johnny Jagger

    One day plants will eat you to death.
    Eat hershey’s. Better. :p
    *waiting for fallout*

  • Eyton Shalom

    As is so often the case in the USA the problem is not the foodstuff, but the people reacting to their unhealthy dietary pasts with extremes such as Vitamixing ridiculously large amounts of Kale, raw. Tell me a single traditional culture that eats large amounts of raw kale? Drinking a tall glass of Kale juice per day is crazy. Moreover, both Chinese Medicine and Ayurveda recommend COOKING your vegetables most of the time and for most veggies. Eat veggies like the Chinese do, lightly cooked, in soups, with lots of other ingredients, and you will be fine. Eyton Shalom, L.Ac.

  • hether

    I wonder how dehydrated kale rates? Not quite the same as cooked at high temps. I wonder what temperature it needs to be cooked at to lessen the goitergenics properties?

  • incorrect_as_always

    And this is why I love fried eggs bacon and red meat. We’ve eaten it for hundreds of thousands of years and we’re still alive. Besides if we weren’t meant to eat animals God wouldn’t make them so damn delicious… Or stupid.

  • Emanuel Pauwels

    Everything in MODERATION. Why is this idea so hard for Americans to understand?

  • Jonathan Fink

    Cucumber, tomato and beets are not vegetables.

  • Colette S

    Everything in moderation.
    Stop letting these doctors and research team ying yank your diet chain.

  • Na_na99

    Or I can just go back to the way I used to eat. No goiters, just your typical diabetes or high blood pressure risks. Drinking too much water will kill. You might also just drop dead someday if you continue breathing. Stop worrying about everything.

  • keithdouglas322

    Like Grandma said,”Eat some of lots of different things, all in moderation.” Cruciferous vegetables aren’t bad for you, excess is. Also, keep in mind that there are no National standards for lab testing in this Country. Check your results against the NIH recommendations as well as European recs. You may be surprised at the discrepencies. Next, BioIdentical hormone therapies are far superior and much less problematic than synthetics. Look into these prior to setting off on any therapies. A visit and in depth conversation with an Endocrinologist should be made to ascertain the necessity of starting on any Hormone regimen, as well. A GP/PCP may have the ability to prescribe whatever they wish. This does not imply that they have the expertise to do so..

  • Karen Nielsen Flowers

    I am hypErthyroid so I need to eat these cruciferous foods. I have too much thyroid in my bloodstream. So understand there are both sides of the Thyroid situation and these foods I NEED to eat to stay healthy. Please mention both sides in the future when you are talking Thyroid.

  • R G

    Most people do not juice their kale and do it everyday (I add ginger and other vegetables and take vitamins) and I drink it with juiced apples and it tastes as good as anything and usually gives me a boost of energy; I’m so lazy I buy it 2 or 3 times and finally have the energy to make it once a month (clean up is a factor). I’d worry about Fukishima before I’d worry about Kale. And couldn’t one take some other substances to counteract any bad effect there MIGHT BE. You will find the meat lobby (and I bet certain energy drinks) making up bs stories to scare people away from veggies. There are people who study and know this stuff so much more deeply. Is it gmo is it organic those are now very important questions. Moderation. Sadly I eat whatever I want and am beginning to see I need to take more care with my diet. Worry will kill you faster than anything. Meditate.

  • Mary Johanna

    I am weary of all this hype, everyday something else. People are really getting confused, first and foremost food is energy to sustain us. There are many more dangers when it comes to thyroid issues, one major issue that is barely mentioned is the plastics in our life, many of this targeted audience is probably having at least one lunch or meal per week in a plastic container… especially hot freshly cooked food served with a nice unregulated chemical mix for lunch. We then shlep around plastic bottles that contaminate the very “healthy” water that we pay two and more dollars for, again with a special chemical mix that will affect our endocrine. People sleep in beds that have been doused in fire retardants and again unregulated, as well as all other chemical pollutants in our clothes, blankets, carpets etc. all of these things affect your endocrine before you have your first bite of Kale. So, check your household, look at the plastic shrink wrap that is wrapped around your dairy products especially because fatty food soaks up more of the plastic chemicals that are unregulated around your food stuff. Unprocessed and natural food is the last thing you should worry about eating when it comes to your endocrine. Eating fish once a weak and yes making sure you’ll have iodine in your diet, but rid your life of plastics, get involved in politics at a local level to demand clean air void of fine particle mass that’ll keep many pollutants out of your body those are the things that add to your quality of life and possibly life span.

  • Robyne75

    My grandma always told me everything in moderation is the key. We Americans hear about a new breakthough food or product and go bizurk and over do it.

    • androphiles

      Just FYI, it’s ‘berserk’.

      • StephanieAndDavid

        I like bizurk better. It’s got a ‘z’ in it. All the kids are into ‘z’.

  • Mason Young

    so many People I know, are experiencing a ‘Kale Shortage’ at the market…
    It is the ‘it’ food, for sure.
    Exceptionally good grower…anywhere.

  • Jan Phillips

    Wow, I try to take good care of my health, ditching the booze, etc. to spend extra on veggies to juice. Does that make me upper middle class? I’m a 67-year-old retired woman.

  • Cheryl A Sophie

    I love Kale for salad greens as well as cooked. What’s surprising is so does Sophie my 4 footer supervisor. I think everything is a balance.

  • you_be_the_change

    so much diverse and heated discussion stimulated by an article about kale… hilarious!! made my day! we humans truly can argue about pretty much anything! #kaleisboring #firstworldproblems

    • androphiles

      Better about nutrition than stupid Benghazi and stupid politics.

  • david

    I have had hypothyroidism for 30 years. I got it when I was 20 and
    pregnant. I take medicine and eat normal. Still just try to eat enough
    of the four basic food groups..also got into juicing etc. Never had
    any problems. Just eat normal works for me. Just always check your
    thyroid levels because your body will change through the years so your
    med dose will occasionally change.

  • Skip Nichols

    Kale is on my list of problem foods for those of us prone to kidney stones

  • rickahontas

    FYI: Brazil nuts lose their selenium content rapidly after removal from their shell. So, if you do use brazil nuts, crack them fresh!

  • Ga Hack

    All things in moderation.. just common sense. Too much of anything can turn into a poison, including water.

    • androphiles

      Water doesn’t turn into anything but water; but like almost everything, in excessive quantity it overwhelms the system and you die.

  • Gabriel ruz

    Write an article now on how bad it is to eat red meat everyday or chicken.
    Not to mention how the world is being silent on how Japan is affecting all of our seafood products!

  • Don’t trust

    OMG people, enough of Obama and class warfare! This is about a freakin’ vegetable!!!! Frack!!! Can we just have an intelligent conversation without interjecting off topic crap? Frack!! Sorry, I didn’t get my serving of kale this morning and I get edgy when that happens… seriously folks stop acting like brats on the playground….

  • Exclusivelymadefor

    I have a slow blood clotting time, if any…found out the hard way Kale had too much vitamin K in it which slows clotting…I was juicing kale in everything everyday. Know your body and what you need and what you don’t…I was bruising all over and didn’t know why…..

  • Guest

    As a dedicated green

  • dee gold

    They also told us not to eat eggs until they realizedthat cagefree, organic-feed hens laid eggs eith yolks that contained enough lecithin to break down cholesterol and fats as to be able to say that that type of egg was actually a well balanced food….INCREDIBLE!

  • StormSister

    Every time a vegetable or fruit that is flagged as troublesome, just as with soy, I believe it has more to do with organic vs. non-organic/gmo than the vegetable itself. I truly believe it is the chemicals that are sprayed on them or the GMO seeds they are grown from, that are causing the problems. We won’t know this until REAL studies are done – if they are done.

  • Lisa Smith-Elyea

    WTF? After searching the internet for what to feed my hypothyroid dog, I was told (by MANY vets) to feed her kale because it’s high in iodine. And now you’re telling me the OPPOSITE is true??? What gives?

    • androphiles

      Probably you should ask your vet. The article is about how kale affects humans.

      • Lisa Smith-Elyea

        Of course I realize the article is about humans; however humans AND dogs have much of the same issues concerning hypothyroidism. However, I will ask my vet, ONCE AGAIN and show him this article.

    • Robin

      Sure you got hypo and not hyper?

      • Lisa Smith-Elyea

        ‘hypo” not “hyper”.

  • JakeBraekesNow

    Beware of anything supposedly healthy served up on an Obama plate or ingested and lauded by “the stars”, as they never let real science get in the way of them feeling good about themselves.

    • terryinindy

      That’s very similar to being wary of anyone who starts out bashing Obama and “stars”, they haven’t a clue about actual science but will try to use the word in a sentence so that it makes their “sour grapes” seem like something of worth to someone other than the RNC.

      • JakeBraekesNow

        Darn, terryinindy, you busted me. I am a card carrying member of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy. It is often the truth that celibs ( and that’s what Obama is) often have no clue about the proclamations they make and positions they take. Take the vaunted FDA Food Pyramid, for instance, with its instruction to load up on grains. Shall we talk insulin resistance?

        • audreydc1983

          The Food Pyramid – or My Plate as it is now known – is the product of the USDA, not the FDA. Yeah, I know – the government has so many alphabet agencies that it gets confusing from time to time as to who oversees what.
          The USDA’s job is to promote US agriculture. NomNom, Grain Subsidies!

          • JakeBraekesNow

            Yes, my error. There are too many lettered agencies. Thanks for the correction and your point is spot on about subsidies.

        • terryinindy

          There is NO problem with Insulin Resistance if you actually get enough exercise and don’t eat several pounds of food at each sitting. Now on with your supposed association with the truth, I see you’ve never really met but your attempt to interject the word “lib” and use it as derogatorily as possible clearly shows that despite the denial, you are indeed one of the “Party of No” and have no actual information worthy of consideration.

          • JakeBraekesNow

            Well, my overly informed friend, quit reading my posts and busy yourself with promoting the next wonder veggie.

  • Mary

    The advice to eat seaweed as a panacea for thyroid problems, particularly hypothyroidsim, is extremely problematic. In iodine sufficient populations (the US is one of them – first world countries in general) consuming too much iodine can trigger hypothyroidsim and elevated TSH levels. I have autimmune hypothyroidism and a holistic nurse practitioner prescribed increasing iodine intake to help remedy elevated TSH levels and autimmune hypothyroidism. After taking a supplement high in iodine and eating more iodine rich foods such as seaweed, my symptoms became drastically worse – labwork showed a spike in TSH levels and physical symptoms increased. In researching on my own,… I discovered data that shows excess iodine intake can trigger hypotyhroidism. I cut out the excess iodine and was careful to limit iodine rich foods and my TSH levels and symptoms improved, without any drugs.

    NPR, how can you write an article recommending solutions for thyroid health without consulting with an endocrinologist?! A health coach providing this kind of advice is dubious and dangerous.

    • Kim Nichols

      I think this suggestion was for people who don’t have a thyroid condition as some properties of cruciferous veggies interfere with iodine uptake – therefore those without thyroid issues would want to add iodine to their diet to avoid possible problems, I too, am hypo and have long avoided large amounts of extra iodine. I use plain salt as well. In the end, it seems people just need to use more common sense. . .juicing is the fad of the day, but would you normally sit down and eat a bunch of kale in one sitting? Try choking down an equivalent amount in a salad or bowl of soup and tell me how yummy that was. A little goes a long way, I say.

      • StephanieAndDavid

        In the summer, I grow a number of types of greens in my back yard garden, including kale. I go out and pick myself some young kale for salads quite often. I drizzle a little olive oil and squeeze some lemon juice and maybe some smoked salt or a little Greek seasoning on it. It’s quite delicious. I’m more of a foodie than a health food eater and would eat it even if it were bad for you. You might want to try this if you have the chance.

    • Kelly2

      This is 100% true. I would not recommend seaweed for thyroid problems without consulting a physician. The Nina Manolson they quoted in this article is not a doctor, but I am. The line about seaweed struck me specifically as something NPR should have vetted. Please, do not self-diagnose and self-treat. Please see your doctor.

  • Guest

    The advice to eat seaweed is extremely problematic. In iodine sufficient populations (the US is one of them – first world countries in general) consuming too much iodine can trigger hypothyroidsim and elevated TSH levels. I have autimmune hypothyroidism and a holistic nurse practitioner prescribed increasing iodine intake to help remedy elevated TSH levels and autimmune hypothyroidism. After taking a supplement high in iodine and eating more iodine rich foods such as seaweed, my symptoms became drastically worse – labwork showed a spike in TSH levels and physical symptoms increased. In researching on my own, I discovered data that shows excess iodine intake can trigger hypotyhroidism. I cut out the excess iodine and was careful to limit iodine rich foods and my TSH levels and symptoms improved, without any drugs.

    NPR, how can you write an article recommending solutions for thyroid health without consulting with an endocrinologist?! A health coach providing this kind of advice is dubious and dangerous.

  • Thathoodwink

    Did you seriously use the word “veggie” in your writing? The word is vegetable. Unless you are a toddler who is struggling with pronouncing his “big people words”.

    • Alex McPhaggot

      No the word is “veg,” as the Michelin star-winning British chef Gordon Ramsay says. And eff off with your pedantic prescriptivism.

    • JakeBraekesNow

      Geeze, take some Prune Juice (organic of course) and loosen your brain. Speaking of big people things, nice baby photo.

  • Andie

    Aha, just as I began to suspect while reading: these issues have typically affected those who eat large, daily portions of these foods. All things in moderation, as the saying goes. Mix it up! I juice one or two times a week, and that’s my kale. I mix spinach leaves with my eggs, and enjoy a wide variety of produce, including nuts and seeds. I just limit my meat and dairy.

  • Charles Rowin

    eat meat. all things in moderation. and unto thee they shall be as food.

  • Vanessa Bagley

    Kale is also very high in vitamin K. Vitamin K is a blood clotter!

  • erbsta

    I enjoy kale with a nice honey glazed vegan stuffed with veal and songbird.

  • toria3463

    I’ve had hypothyroidism for 11 years and I’ve been a vegetarian for 5. It wasn’t until I became a vegetarian that my thyroid levels evened out. I haven’t had to change my dose in 5 years and I attribute that only to my diet. Eating a plant based diet is medicine in itself. I will not stop eating Kale, spinach or any other vegetable I love. If you have hypothyroidism, do what’s best for your body regardless of what people say (doctors included.)

  • Elsa De Fraga-Connor

    I haven’t juiced kale but I ate it all my life,I am Portugueses ,we eat kale soup almost daily, its great and good for you…I and my 3 sisters have no problems…but like everything if you abuse it it will harm you….
    I knew someone that drank too much water,he end it up in dialysis…too much of a good thing …

  • mickey

    so are eggs ok to eat this week??

  • StephanieAndDavid

    The idea of ‘magic’ foods is simply silly and overeating anything isn’t a good idea. Apparently, no one seems to understand the concept of moderation.

  • Virginia Sowell

    If you truly have hypothyroidism you need to see an endocrinologist. I have a wonderful physician who has never told me to avoid those foods.

    • thisonly

      But competitive kale eating is only a recent phenomenon. Your doctor would never think to warn you not to drink a tall glass of kale juice because, no one in their right mind would do that.

  • Sally Brodsky

    Everything in moderation.

    • androphiles

      Including moderation.

  • fyrewede

    Please read this brilliant piece of *satire* along these lines but with a very thought-provoking follow-up at the end. I suggest taking it all with a big grain of salt, including the studies:

  • Ricky Spanish

    Look at me! Look at me! I’m so hip and cool kicking back enjoying a kale colonic just burning up the veggisphere. #8rolleyes

  • Stephanie L. Pyke

    Try these:
    spirulina, canteloupe, coconut and kumquat
    Wheatgrass, cucumber, mint and lime.

    finnochio(stem, leaves and bulb), red apple, ginger, and then flavor with: clove, cinnamon, nutmeg for flavor and low sulfur, full strength molasses to taste.

    Molasses is sugar, but it’s the flavor and iron and calcium benefits you want from it. That recipe should taste faintly like a molasses spice cookie.

  • ModerateLew

    I’ve coined a new phrase: Everything in moderation.

  • hereatpsu

    This shows that a pig eating lots of kale greedily will get thyroid problems, no matter what kind lipstick you put on the pig. You have to wholesome and not greedy

  • Vanessa Howe

    Everything in moderation, except cigarettes.

  • HashimotoHealth

    You have to eat an excessive amount of uncooked (key word) kale daily. I have a thyroid condition and the health benefits of Kale outweigh their goitergenic properties, (which is also in Broccoli, Cabbage, Brussel Sprouts, Spinach, and many other leafy greens that have vital nutrients). I eat a little of these cooked and have no issues. I also eat plenty of them uncooked. My healthy whole foods diet full of leafy greens has done more for my health than harm. I feel a balance between good nutritional health, exercise, and modern medicine will help myself and anyone with a thyroid condition lead a full and healthy life. All things in moderation. A person with thyroid concerns could still follow the advice in this article and eat Kale.

    • HashimotoHealth

      There also is no evidence to state that these healthy foods will cause anyone to have a thyroid condition. The main cause is genetics, radiation, cancer… certainly not vegetables…

      • jacksmind

        There certainly is *SOME* evidence. The article cites it:

        If you read the article you find several lines of evidence, based on epeidemoligcal evidence, and our understanding of the goitrogenic (suppressing thyroid function) effects of Glucosinolates found in foods such as kale.

        That doesn’t mean that kale isn’t, on the whole, good for you in moderation–it’s still a superfood. We probably could all stand to add plenty of it to our diet.

  • Sarah Morrigan

    all things in moderation

  • Saturday Tuesday

    She was eating 2kg/day. Enough said. This is an article about an extreme outlier and anecdotes doth not data make.

    • jacksmind

      But the question is where to draw the line based on risk. How much does 0.5kg/day increase the chances of reduced thyroid function? We all know that daily moderate consumption of things like kale are great for us and cause no harm. But certainly there are people out there who are downing 2 kale smoothies a day and eating brussel sprouts every night for dinner. This information is something they would probably like to have to make well-informed decisions.

      • Florida Farmer

        But are people really eating 1.1 pounds of kale a day (0.5 kg), every day? Even that seems like a LOT of kale, even for people who think more of a good thing must be good.

        • jacksmind

          Well the assumption (I didn’t check the claim above) is that the woman who fainted to bok choy consumption was consuming 2kg a day. So yes it does happen. Either way it doesn’t really matter. The point is there is a limit where it might be deemed dangerous to consume WAY too much kale. How would you define, ‘WAY too much’? Is it 0.5kg? Is it 0.3kg? 0.1kg? The point is that people should be aware of over-consumption of these cruciferous vegetables. It’s not as if there’s this hard line between ‘safe amounts’ and ‘no way anyone would ever eat that much’, that no one ever crosses. So to the original point, That’s why information like this is important: not because 99% of the people on here are consuming too much kale, but for the 1% who might be.

          • Florida Farmer

            I understand it does happen, but those are outliers and I cannot imagine that regular old normal people are eating so much kale, which is lower on the oxalate scale than other greens, that they’re suddenly going to have issues with calcium uptake, kidney stones, hypothyroidism, etc. Have you ever seen how much 1.1 pounds of kale is? Half a pound? If there were this much rampant overconsumption here, surely there would be more articles about it happening. Yes, consuming any one thing WAY too much is probably going to have some side effects, but that WAY too much depends on the individual person, not some arbitrary number picked out of the air due to scaremongering articles (“ZOMG! Stop juicing!”) like the one Berman wrote (that led to this one).

          • jacksmind

            1) No one said that normal people are eating that much Kale, only that some people who have daily kale juice along with other cruciferous veggies, might.

            2) 1.1 pounds of kale, when juiced fills half a liter. Half a pound would be 1/4 a liter, or less than double the amount you see shown in this instructional video:

            3) Maybe you came to this article from a different one that was hyperbolic, but no one said there was ‘rampant overconsuption’. In fact, a quick text search of this page shows that you are the first person mentioning those words (and was never mentioned in the nytimes article)

            4) Yes, WAY too much does depend on the individual person, but there is a point at which it’s WAY too much for most individuals.

            5) There is no arbitrary number. In fact, there is no number at all. No studies have been done to determine the point at which these veggies would cause a risk to someone. But that also means if you bought a juicer and love a big glass of kale juice twice a day and brussel sprouts for dinner, that this information is not irrelevant to you. In fact, it’s important for you understand not overdo it.

            6) Again, maybe you came from a different place that was exaggerating this article. But the nytimes article never said stop juicing. In fact, the only mention of juicing aside from the title was to mention that she consumed (overconsumed?) large amounts of these veggies.

            So to the point: No one is saying that you should ‘stop juicing’ or that there’s ‘rampant overconsumption’. It’s just something some people should know about, since large quantities is a possible hazard.

          • Florida Farmer

            Good lord, dude. My comment is directed at the panicky sheep who decide something they read on the internet must be true, and now they need to stop juicing because omgbbq! someone diagnosed with hypothyroidism also read on the internet that kale was possibly a cause, but missed all the other stuff about what the woman was eating, didn’t notice she failed to list any studies to back it up, didn’t say how much she was eating, and didn’t have any possible medical diagnoses to back up what she decided could be the cause (and thus why she stopped eating kale) – and also failed to read the notes on the one study of an old lady consuming tons of raw bok choy who had issues.

            My point is that IF there were a lot of people eating this way day after day after day – rampant overconsumption – then we would probably have exactly the sort of data you’re wondering about, because someone would have decided it would be a good study to do.

            And yes, I have read other articles/blog posts that people have written about this, where they engage in just that sort of hyperbolic nonsense because they read the title of the NYT piece and either don’t bother to read the rest, or don’t bother to understand what they’re reading and apply a little common sense and reasoning.

          • jacksmind

            Well if you were making a irrelevant, tangential point, then fine. But it’s really hard to tell that you were talking about something that didn’t have anything to do with the nytimes article, didn’t have anything to do with this article, and didn’t have anything to do with the original comment of this thread in a reply to my post. So I hope it’s obvious why I might think you are responding to this article when the comment is on the same page and replying to my post.

            But actually we do have evidence that substiences found in these veggies do cause hypothyroidism, epidemiological evidence (in other cultures), and individual medical studies–it’s not just the case study of the old lady. In fact, it very may well have been her kale consumption, because we know that it’s possible.

            So what we have is:
            1) We know that kale (and other veggies like it) have the possibility of causing hypothyroidism
            2) Some people (not lots) consume lots of this stuff
            3) Kale is good for almost everyone in moderate amounts
            4) There’s nothing really wrong about this article or the nytimes article (at least mostly factual from what I could tell, though the headline could have been a bit smarter), 5) It’s a good thing that people be made aware of the dangers of overconsumption (same with say, water during a marathon).

            I’m assuming you agree with all these, if you were talking about some other people or other blogs that were going crazy saying ban all jucing, yeah, that’s crazy, and I agree that’s silly. But it certainly isn’t me, this article, the nytimes article, or almost all people on these threads, which is why I was confused. If I misinterpreted what you said, I apologize.

  • Noel Rodriguez

    I make a smoothie every day, on alternate days I also juice plenty of fresh greens. I practiced this for years just for me. My wife was a go, go, go person surviving on a cup of coffee and out the door to work person. That is, until she was diagnosed with ALS. Three years ago we got the sobering news about my wife’s condition and she joined the smoothie juicing regimen. She is still walking and talking, although it is hard for her and she tires easily. But, we went through special trial medications at the Medical center in Houston, Texas and the team of doctors all wanted to know what we were doing because she seemed so good. I’m 61 and eat pretty much what ever I want. I love a good steak. I eat plenty of butter. I hunt and prepare game meals regularly. But, I don’t take a single pharmaceutical, not even over the counter medications. Juicing & making smoothies works for me and it has helped my wife too!

  • Bryan J. Maloney

    Hey! I’ve a kooky idea! How about NOT TREATING FOOD LIKE MEDICATION? How about EXERCISING MODERATION? Nah, won’t work–the food cultists can’t think like that.

    • Joe Stauffacher

      Anything we consume can be thought of like medicine as it should be because we are what we eat. Exercise is awesome, it’s also overrated compared to eating healthy. More often than not an obese person can change their physical appearance faster with food than exercise. Lots of people over exercise creating too many acids in the body.

      • Bryan J. Maloney

        So, which brand of cereal’s box did you get your biology degree out of?

        • Joe Stauffacher

          LOL, I do my own research rather than regurgitate the biology of the telephone game as played in the school system.

          Whether it’s a pharmaceutical medication, a homeopathic medication, or food. Sh!t even a hug affects the chemistry of the body. Rather than think in terms of medication, how about think in terms of optimum production. Treat yourself as the experiment.

          “Let food be thy medicine and let medicine be thy food.” – Hippocrates

          With appropriate exercise you still need appropriate nutrition based on the exercise for a healthy body.

          Here’s a post touching on the biology.

        • Joe Stauffacher

          “Biology of Belief” is an awesome book too.

  • terryinindy

    Or, you could just NOT EAT IT. The greatest majority of “greens” aren’t tasty at all and having the fact that many people on warfarin either have to eat it regularly or not at all, it just loos like another one of those fads.

    • sisterfunkhaus

      They aren’t tasty to you. We love greens here, raw and cooked. No fad foods here, just a healthy balanced diet.

      • terryinindy

        Hint, if you have to learn to like it, it tastes like crap.
        Which “we” are you referring to, the mouse in your pocket, because you sure aren’t able to speak for anyone other than yourself.

    • Kris Larson

      Cutting out high salt & sugar & eating greens fresh makes the greens much more tasty. And you get a lot more nutrition for your money than adding supplements to your diet.

      • terryinindy

        Really? Because those Assumptions you’re making are making your “advice” sound like just another inapplicable health rant.

    • StephanieAndDavid

      Not tasty? I love greens; sauteed in butter, steamed, boiled with a little smoked meat, young tender greens as a salad with some olive oil and Greek seasoning and maybe a squeeeeze of lemon juice (and fresh tomatoes, when you can get them.) I have a 17 x 17 garden in my back yard filled with greens during the growing season and we eat them every day. Perhaps you are preparing your greens incorrectly.

      • terryinindy

        And perhaps you have no taste.

    • Joe Stauffacher

      Why would a person want to eat “Greens”?

      Chlorophyll is almost identical to hemoglobin, only difference is the nucleus. Chlorophyll is magnesium, and our blood nucleus is iron. The sun produces chlorophyll for plants like it creates vitamin D for humans. Research the vitamin D / magnesium connection. I doubt mother nature is a fad.

      • terryinindy

        Almost Identical….that still means “different”.
        I don’t have a reason to research the connection, I’m not the one searching for a nebulous comment to justify why a Fad is a Fad, and argue against the fact that Kale doesn’t taste good. That is neither an assault on Mother Nature nor is it any less true. Quinoa was/is another one of those “hot” fad foods, the taste wasn’t spectacular BUT once the Viewing Public got to see it and hear all the reports, the locals who ate it as a staple of their diet don’t eat it much anymore, it’s far more valuable to sell to people like those “defending” kale.

        • Joe Stauffacher

          Cannabinoids are “almost identical” to the nervous system. Did you know the only other place besides a cannabis plant that you will find cannabinoids in nature? Human breast milk! The mothers nervous system literally builds the babies nervous system.

          Quinoa is a staple food for good health. High in magnesium, alkaline for the blood, and numerous amino acids (aka protein source).

          • terryinindy

            Perhaps you should lay off the cannabanoids, your post wouldn’t come out as unrelated garbage if you did.

          • Joe Stauffacher

            I figure it’s better to educate you than to reply negatively putting you down.

          • terryinindy

            You aren’t educating anyone. Sorry Sheldon, you’ve bored another group.

    • Florida Farmer

      Greens may not be tasty to you, but a lot of people like them quite a bit. It isn’t a “fad” to eat food that one likes to eat.

      • terryinindy

        Kale is a Fad, when 10 years have passed and everybody that STARTED eating Kale are still eating that, you can then change it’s status to a regular staple.

        • Florida Farmer

          Kale’s been around a lot longer than you or I, but sorry I didn’t recognize you as the sole authority on what constitutes regular eating for people, given your absolute knowledge of what everyone on the entire planet eats on a daily basis.

          • terryinindy

            I’m sure there are quite a few things you don’t recognize, that doesn’t make your lack of recognition important or relevant.

  • What?

    Big truck load of crap. Kale is a staple food in other countries, is eaten for lunch, dinner and sometimes even breakfast,

  • Brian George

    Bottom line is BALANCE…. Too much of anything is not recommended…

  • Katrina Oakes

    The connection is not the kale itself, it’s actually the amount of radioactive ions that are coming WITH the kale. It’s directly from the nuclear spill at Fukushima, TEPCO, Japan. These thyroid conditions are in direct correlation to the isotopes that collect in green plants such as kale, broccoli and other green ground vegetables that is causing the thyroid conditions. If the plants wouldn’t have been exposed to the isotopes we wouldn’t even see any type of correlation. Humans have been consuming these plants for such a long time, these cases of hypothyroidism are a new wave of the effects from radioactive waste.

  • Jimmy Campbell

    has the word MODERATION escaped everyone’s vocabulary?

  • jpsaverino

    Hey, eating the same thing every day is unhealthy. Hey, eating too much of one thing is unhealthy. I can’t believe we’re still stuck on these two points after 70 years of modern nutrition, chemistry and biology.

    Eating anything every morning makes your ds lazy, insisting on buying lots of any ONE “great” crop encourages more monoculture farming! More market fluctuation and more abuses by giant farms trying to get massive amounts to market (a la cutting corners… ) Don’t turn kale into the next eggs and pork belly. It’s very easy to do.

    You people are merely children chasing fad obsessions trying to gain an extra year of life. Try using the years you have BETTER and get off your asses at work.

  • Tracy Redfern

    All things in excess are bad. Switch up the morning smoothies and cook your veg and eat with dinner. All things in moderation. Gotta live your life.

  • Unice Dweeb


  • Jenn Lopez

    Iodine deficeincy is not a problem in the United States. Iodized salt is in everything. In fact, we probably consume too much iodine. I can’t believe this article was posted by NPR. It’s much more suited to a magazine.

    • Andie

      That’s true. Perhaps our nation’s rise in hypothyroidism is due to us consuming too much salt as a whole? It would make sense; the body won’t produce the chemical if it’s getting it from other sources because it will attempt to level it out.

  • Arne Grostøl

    UTTERLY UTTERLY UTTERLY UTTERLY STUPID thing… Even water is toxic in high dosis… eating 1-1.5 kilos of something is always a bad idea no matter what it is… they should stop making these completly horrendously stupid articles that has no validity whatsofuckinever

    • Andie

      It’s like they’re trying to make people afraid to eat fruits and veggies, maybe in the hopes that they’ll eat more junk/processed foods instead… You know those companies have been losing profits ever since more people started wanting to “get healthy” and “go green”.

  • Erica

    I’m trying to deduce whether the opposite would be true, then. Would eating kale and other cruciferous vegetables be beneficial for someone with HYPERthyroidism?

    • Andie

      Excellent question. Wish the author of the article would have considered this.

  • iorr61

    Well, there goes the healthy part of my diet. I’m hypo, a male at that, with high cholesterol, too. All the alternate been veggies mentioned aren’t as nutritious as those to be avoided. Meat, especially red, no. Soy, almonds, Brazil nuts; no,no,no. Sugar; no, which rules out eating much fruit. Of course, there are the studies that found grains are bad, thus another no. The list goes on. I’m doomed to die of starvation in the pursuit of good health.

  • big_trev

    the obamas eating kale proves its disgustingly bad for you and will make you make horrible decisions that fuck America up lol weirdo kale eaters have a fuckin burger already the obamas did and isn’t that what everyones obsessed with is what the hell the obamas are doing? who gives a shit what celebrities and presidents eat it tastes like shit and makes your farts smell horrible yall are the leading cause of global warming

    • StephanieAndDavid

      Is this satire?

      • Cheyenne


    • GreatGreenSea

      You’re a complete moron

  • Michelle Burnett

    I have hypothyroidism and love kale – I grow my own, in fact. I read the piece Jennifer Berman wrote in the NYT and dismissed it as being very melodramatic. Either her doctor didn’t give her good advice when she was diagnosed with hypothyroidism, or she didn’t listen to what her doctor said. My doctor encouraged me to continue eating cruciferous vegetables, but to eat them lightly cooked most of the time – he just wanted me to limit eating the veggies raw, because of the issues outlined above. Juicing can be problem, but if you are juicing once or twice a week, it’s generally fine (he did tell me he would prefer if I didn’t juice kale). I also was advised to eat sea vegetables – the “seaweed snacks” they sell are pretty tasty and an easy way to integrate sea veggies into your diet, but moderation is key there, too. I still eat Brussels sprouts (YUM), flaxseed, peaches, strawberries, etc. I think Berman clicked on the first link she saw, which was probably a Mercola-type fearmongering site, and took the information as gospel, without checking the medical research or – DUH – calling her doctor back for more information.

    This is what irritates me about the media, these days – any crackpot piece that gets published gets endless “legs” because it gets repeated and rehashed. I consider both the NYT and NPR to be reliable media sources, but the fact that both gave Berman’s piece legitimacy makes me both concerned and suspicious. Her piece wasn’t based in any kind of real science. She’s not a doctor or an nutritionist.

    • Florida Farmer

      I agree with you completely. Personally, I love how people gloss over the one study cited here, where a woman ate over a kilo(!) of raw bok choy every day for months and had issues, and start crying about how they’ll have to give up their kale. Of course she had issues! Unless they’re eating almost 2.5 pounds of the stuff, raw, every day, for months on end, they’re being just as melodramatic as Berman (who provided no information on any such studies and apparently didn’t bother to ask her supposed doctor) was in her article.

    • mike23t

      The article states clearly that if you cook your kale and don’t juice it (ie. concentrate large amounts of it)… so is your problem with this article that it is saying exactly the same thing as your doctor? Or is it that no one reads the whole thing and draws the wrong conclusions from it?

      • Kris Larson

        Articles like this have a bad habit of implying that something is ‘bad’ or ‘dangerous’ regardless of whether a close reading makes that case or not. It’s a simple habit of the media. Obviously most people know that you can overdose on anything, which it sounds like people in these examples were doing. Essentially this article concludes that we really shouldn’t worry about kale, or any crucifer, as long as it’s not the only thing we eat. Duh. But, that’s not the ‘gist’ of the ‘feel’ or the headline of this article.

        • mike23t

          “Articles don’t sell newspapers, headlines do” — every media editor in history

  • Jimmy Hodum

    Also, these foods are high in oxalic acids, which can contribute to kidneystones. Best way to avoid the high oxalics is to either cook the greens a bit like they say here, and to use more Lacinato kale because it has about half as much of the oxalic acid than typical green kale.

  • Bert

    This is all part of the demonization of saturated fats in meat and the consequences of eating a low fat diet. Your main source of nourishment should come in the forms of pasture raised meat, eggs, raw dairy, wild-caught seafood and vegetables. Cut out the grains, sugar, seed-vegetable oils and limit the raw green juices. And for the love of GOD do not take vaccines ! Eat fermented vegetables and dairy and supplement with cod fish liver oil.

    • GreatGreenSea

      Stop spreading misinformation.

      • Bert

        What info do you believe is wrong ? Everything I have posted is a fact. Read it and weep ! You are all Zombie Lemmings !

    • Florida Farmer

      Ah, antivaxxer nonsense. Simple to ignore.

      • Bert

        Vaccines have never been proven safe or effective. Every vaccine was introduced after the targeted disease was already in decline. The Government’s official line is that vaccines do not cause autism, yet in court they’ve conceded that it has and have payed out millions in injury compensation for causing it. You just don’t hear about it because you are one of the sheep. Baaaaaa !

        • Florida Farmer

          Sure, dude. Whoever doesn’t buy your crazy train is a sheep.

          • Bert

            The crazy train is believing that the vaccine companies are acting in your best interests considering that they are not even liable for their mistakes. Tax payers are paying for their mistakes. The really sad part is that 2/3’s are turned away despite their vaccination injury. Go ahead and vax your kids, natural selection often works in mysterious ways. BAAAAAAAAAAAA !!!!!!

      • Bert
      • Bert

        Yes, it’s easy to just denounce an antivaxer as a luny. That’s how big pharma does it to anyone who disagrees to their profit machine. You are just one of many sheep with your head in the sand waiting to get screwed up your butt !

  • alliew

    *goes in bathroom and pukes up morning kale smoothie*

  • Kerry Stottlemyer

    It will also cause Oxalate stone in your kidneys if you are not careful. it’s rare but does happen. Eat some meat you damn vego’s

  • Teresa M Wheeler

    All I know, I feel better than I have in 20 years. I will continue to juice and if I die, I’ll be dead.

  • C.S. Stone

    all things in moderation people… geez…

  • Katrina Brees

    I’m bored with reports about how vegetables are bad. How about a report on why smoking is bad or meat. But no, its always that vegetables are bad for you. Whatever.

  • Betty Eyer

    This is ridiculous. Animal studies with VERY LARGE servings. You have ONE human who ate one to one and a half KILOS a day and she went into a coma in her 80s. So for that I should give up raw kale? Come on. MODERATION and VARIETY people. Get a grip.

    • Tyler

      I bet I can eat complete garbage and live longer than you.

      • Charlotte11

        You know what? Knock yourself out.

      • Niecey

        I am sure your body will thank you for it.

      • Terri Massa

        It isn’t about living longer. It’s about having quality life the years you do live. My family lives a long time, despite bad habits, but the last 10 years or so of their lives are not pleasant.

        • dudebuddypal

          The last 10 years of most people’s lives aren’t usually all that pleasant unless they die in an accident that cuts their expected natural life short.

          • Terri Massa

            Nonsense. There’s a huge difference between having some normal slowing down from aging and being hospital-ridden for years before you die.

      • Betty Eyer

        Cause you are 12?

      • Jake Stine

        It’s pretty much proven now that four things matter way more than anything else:

        1. Don’t smoke.
        2. Low-stress and active lifestyle.
        3. Don’t eat a lot of refined sugars.
        4. Avoid trans-fats.

        Almost nothing else has been indicated to actually matter one way or another, with regard to cholesterol or cancer or long term survival. When it comes to human diets, t’s ALL been a case of correlation vs. causation.

        Lard? Not so bad for us. Complex carbs? Not so bad for us. Beef? Not so bad for us. All of those things have only looked bad because we’ve been mixing them with copious amounts of SUGAR, TRANS-FATS, and (until recently) cigarettes.

    • Anne Stockwell

      Haha tomatoes are a NIGHTSHADE! Oh no! ;-)

      • derpyou

        where was the joke?

    • mike23t

      The article doesn’t say to stop eating it. It says pretty clearly that you should eat it in moderation and variety.

      There are 4 bullet points at the end of the article that cover your exact point.

      Also there is medical backing for this, and the article also says that it’s excessive kale (and other vegetables) that cause this – and it’s the same studies that say moderation and variety that will prevent this.

      • hereatpsu

        What does the sensationalist headline say though?

        • Charles Rowin

          cant remember and dont want to scroll up to find out. fyi, “dont judge a book by its cover” means, you cant just read the title.

        • derpyou

          says eat around it.. doesn’t say avoid it. Quit whining.

          • hereatpsu

            ok. I thought the headline said “(you leave the kale dark side up in the middle of the plate and) eat around it!”

        • mike23t

          The headline isn’t the article.

      • melanie adams

        you took the words right out of my mouth! lol

        • hereatpsu

          the headline took the kale out of my mouth

          • melanie adams

            you are FUNNY!

      • Betty Eyer

        The head line and the tone is pretty melodramatic. And note all the people posting who think they can’t eat it now.

    • Susanna Sisson

      This was the most ridiculous article I’ve ever read, poorly written and skewed with only partial details and references in the links (68) and (69) that actually support eating kale and other green veggies. If an 88 year old was eating over 3 pounds of bok choy daily for months what else was she eating? That’s not a normal diet. Was she getting any other nutrients-like PROTEIN, which is necessary for muscle function (and the heart is a muscle remember) and other types of vegetables? I use Lugol’s solution to supplement my iodine as well as Himalayan sea salt. Where did the author get that information? Why the sensational title? Best advice as a nurse and nutritional counselor…keep eating your greens, especially KALE and spinach.

      • Charles Rowin

        best advice as a nurse and nutritional counselor should be to keep up with the latest research and not second guess the doctors and scientists who you really want to be more like.

        • Susanna Sisson

          I made the comment BECAUSE of of the doctors I know and what they know and they would agree with me…they also take large doses of Iodine because they know the RDA is way too low.

          • Charles Rowin

            good for them. i cant wait to hear from them.

      • Kathryn Bulver

        The Himalayan sea salt does not contain iodine, as it is something that is added to salt. As a ‘nutritional counselor,’ you should be aware of that.

        • Susanna Sisson
        • Susanna Sisson

          Iodine is a halogen found in nature….lack of adequate iodine in the body will lead not only to hypothyroidism but secondarily to thyroid, breast and prostate cancers. Other halogens such as Chlorine (which most of our vegetables and even meats such as chicken are “washed” in), Bromide (which was used to replace iodine in flour) and Fluoride (a poison placed in most water supplies) deplete iodine in the body. Read the book Iodine: Why You Need It, Why You Can’t Live Without It by David Brownstein. The RDA for Iodine is 150mcg, while in actuality most people need much more for proper thyroid function due to the toxins found in our food and water supply.

      • boatkitten

        Sorry, but using Lugol’s is insane. That is not a “supplement”, that’s enough iodine to completely kill your thyroid forever. Lugol’s – just 1mg (1000mcg) – is used by emergency rooms to stop thyroid storms. Use Iodized salt instead (just .015 mg) or eat two enriched eggs every day. That will give you all the iodine you need for normal thyroid function..

        • Susanna Sisson

          I’ve been a nurse since 1989. Most of my friends are physicians. They ALL use Iodarol or Lugol’s – anywhere from 12mg to 100mg without any negative side effects. Since I began using Lugols, all of my symptoms of hyothyroidism including the brain fog are gone. I feel better than I’ve felt in years and have been on it for almost a year. I was MISdiagnosed as having a “normal” thyroid level. I asked for my lab results and found I actually had a low thyroid level. I also use bioidentical hormones. You really SHOULD read Brownstein’s book that I mentioned on Iodine as well at Dr. Hotze’s book on hypothyroidism. Both recommend supplementing with iodine and not the piddly 150mcg that the RDA suggests. You should look into the iodine loading test as well as the bromide toxicity test…and if you have fluoride in your water or use fluoride products you definetely need iodone to detox. Find a good doctor that has done research as both these doctors have.

    • Charles Rowin

      go ahead fill your body with goiters. who cares? i hope you do!

    • derpyou

      quit whining.

    • Crz

      The article didn’t say to give it up; it said enjoy in moderation. Some people become fanatics and go overboard when they think something is good for them. This article helps those folks understand that a balanced diet is important, and that eating too much of any one thing can be bad.

  • Jason Caucutt

    It’s funny how the “Sleeper” scenario of Woody Allen has partially come true. Someone coming up with a list of “bad” foods to make a shocking point probably wouldn’t just generically say “steak” in 2013. The whole “red meat and eggs are terrible for you” is pretty 1970s/1980s thinking. I also don’t particularly view “wheat germ” as a health food in 2013 either.
    No one is particularly viewing hot fudge as a health food, though.

  • ZaCloud

    I’ve said this so very, very many times. I’ll continue to always. The one quote from the Bible that even the firmest of atheists should heed: “Everything in moderation.”

    We’re made to use a balance, of a little bit of everything. The elements in one thing are best paired with another thing, and so on and so forth. There are good and bad aspects to EVERYTHING. Everyone keeps doing these fad diets where they increase one or a couple of specific things, only to find detriments to their health. That’s why you should have SOME of a good thing, but never TOO MUCH of it.

    Our most necessary vitamins and minerals can ALL be toxic when consumed in excess. But a little bit of each work in harmony.

    Never fad diet or take extreme supplements, or focus your diet around only one or a few main items. Everything in moderation. Variety is the spice of life. A little bit of everything (within reason of course).

    If only everyone would make that their motto, life would be so much simpler, we’d have less obsessions, and we’d have a full and well-balanced life.

    • Walter Thespeeddemon Gates Jr.

      i couldnt agree with you more well written man.

    • R Joseph Owles

      Where does the Bible say “Everything in moderation”? Socrates was the one to counsel “Everything in Moderation.” Buddha’s Eight-fold path teaches moderation. But the Bible does not.

    • riderbymyside

      “Everything in moderation” is not a biblical quote. It may be Aristotle, but it’s not from whoever wrote the bible.

      • ZaCloud

        Ouch, ok ok people I get the point! I was just told this by my parents and other adults around me all my life. And if you look up the quote plus the word “bible” on Google, you’ll see I’m FAR from the only one!

        SORRY SORRY SORRY barrage of correctors, you made your point enough to drown the actual point on a technicality. Edited the comment.

    • Florida Farmer

      “The problem with internet quotes is that you can’t always depend on their accuracy.” -Abraham Lincoln, 1864

    • billdavis

      Most atheists obviously know the bible better than you do. That isn’t in the bible.

    • RoyD

      Everything in moderation??? How about some arsenic in moderation? Or some gluten in moderation for a celiac? Or how about smoking cigarettes in moderation? Everything in moderation is a stupid saying, open your mind and broaden your horizons. SHFM.

      • Shawna

        How about some less extreme examples in moderation? Sure, there are some things out there that are pure poison for some people, but the idea that you shouldn’t obsess over ONE thing is a good belief to live by.

      • mike23t

        how about taking everything too literally in moderation?

      • Fergus McStokes

        Actually, our bodies do require some arsenic. Broaden your own horizons.

      • ZaCloud

        I said “within reason, of course.” Do you not understand what reason is? ;P

    • Think Tank

      The Bible doesn’t say that, but Proverbs contains a similar sentiment: “If you have found honey, eat only enough for you, lest you have your fill of it and vomit it.” Proverbs, 25:16.

    • Shawna

      Funny you would cite this as only a Christian belief. Are you sure you’re not Taoist?

      • ZaCloud

        Never said it was “only” Christian. And I was mistaken about its origin anyway. >.<

    • michael james

      People who quote the Bible should follow the “moderation” mantra a little more, especially when they’re not quite sure of what is in it.

    • Erik Espinoza

      Where is that in the Bible? I couldn’t find it. Oh, a Google search did find a result: “The Stupid Bitch’s Guide to Convenient Bible Quotes”.

  • bazlith

    no mention of how kale and some other of these kinds of veggies can help prevent macular degeneration or slow it down.

    • Redmond Jennings

      I don’t think the point of the article was to cover the entire nutritional profile of kale.

  • rebeccadru

    Our doc says anything with Iodine is a NO-NO…no brazil nuts… if you have hashimoto’s…

    • Penny

      my x husband was told that too, but he has hyperthyroid

  • Megan

    What a waste of time and media space. Kale is a health hazard if you eat it in excess for an extended period of time? Thanksss.

    • nnyl

      You probably haven’t dealt with hypothyroidism.

      • StephanieAndDavid

        If you have hypothyrodism, you know you shouldn’t eat certain things. For the rest of us, this warning is unnecessary. When I eat wild rice (not regular rice) my body acts like it’s been poisoned but I certainly don’t expect news outlets to do articles about it. I know not to eat and so I don’t.

    • StacyLOliver

      It’s also a hazard if you are on TRH medicines or were already diagnosed with hypothyroidism. I think that’s the more important information.

    • nuitgoddess

      Kale isn’t the only goitrogenic veggie or fruit. So day after day, if you are eating kale and spinach and strawberries and soy and cauliflower and peaches … you are loading up on goitrogens and wondering why you can be so exhausted, your hair is falling out, skin is flaking and dry …

  • jefe68

    This speaks volumes to how upper middle class Americans are so obsessed with their diets that it makes them sick. For the love decent eating, just stop with the smoothies in the morning and eat kale for dinner, cooked as a side dish.
    It’s amazing, really amazing how obsessed we can become about food and take all the joy out of it.

    • Meg

      Also the idea if something is good for you then MORE must be better…no everything in moderation even kale!

      • Elyse

        I agree!

    • PK0702

      “This speaks volumes to how upper middle class Americans…” Nothing like little class warfare…the modus operadi of a Obama voter.

      • MammaG123

        Are you mental? What the eff does this have to do with our President?

        • Jimmy Hodum

          its the internet… people somehow always find a way to inject religion or politics or something else completely irrelevant to the actual conversation.. it sucks :(

          • Kaleb Rippstein

            Its called Obama Derangement Syndrome. Anything and everything ties back to the president for those with this debilitating mental illness.

          • Amy Spreeman

            I blame Bush. ;-)

          • howcool

            It’s not the internet… it’s the INTERNET IN THE U.S. where the localized and distorted versions of religion and politics are the fogged-up lenses through which everything is viewed.

          • SirenoftheSea

            Likely they are being paid by that Adelson creep or the Koch bros. to be on line and diss Obama 24/7 so that they can continue to make money hand over fist while destroying the planet and the fabric of American society and import jobs elsewhere.

        • big_trev

          obviously everyone eats it because theyre obsessed with the celebrity president hes a shitty president and I blame it on kale because I know it pisses yall off ill take my cheeseburgers and yall can keep the damn “change”

          • Sunnyhorse

            By all means, go away and be illiterate by yourself. We’ll all be much happier without you.

          • Mary Cummings

            Hate much?? Run your own life the way you want. Hating shouldn’t be one of your choices. We put up with your brilliant, Bush. You can hang tight with the Obamas. BTW, NO ONE eats differently because the president does, anymore than one smokes or quits because the president does. So quit blaming and live YOUR OWN life and make something of yourself because you value your life and what you do with your mind… might be more happy if you lightened up and took a look at ourselves, instead of focusing so much venom at one guy who doesn’t care a hoot about you, personally. I mean he might, if you were doing some GOOD with your time here on the planet.

          • Bob

            Best response ever.

        • PK0702

          What does the “upper middle class Americans” have to do with kale?

          • mike23t

            Having worked in a grocery store a number of years, I can tell you it’s upper middle class Americans who are “excited” about kale. They buy it more and it is a topic of conversations. While poor Americans buy it, they aren’t “excited” about it.

          • Bill Morgan

            That’sbecause the rest of us grow our own:) Just saying.

          • Mary Johanna

            Wish I could grow my own, grow anything really would be great. I tried but here in Hawaii the sun kills most of my efforts. Love Kale

          • Shelly

            Right! Eating well for the most part is not cheap. And poor people don’t have time to be discussing the nutritional content of anything. They simply want to eat. Rich/upper “whatever” class, are usually the ones discussing the benefits of eating this and eating that.

          • Mary Johanna

            Well, I mentioned earlier that I grew up in Europe and we did not have much meat or desserts at that time. Every Sunday in the afternoon we had a piece of cake that was home made, Sunday also was usually a meat day and during the week it was a lot of legumes and beans and simple stuff. I find that the “poor folk” diet is what these “trendy eaters” are going for now. Eating well can be done on a low budget, just plan your meals and don’t waste. I see a lot of waste when I watch how people shop.

          • Shelly

            I totally agree with you. Yes, like you said it’s the “poor folk” food that is now “considered” healthy. And eating well can be done on a budget. Unfortunately however, “poor folk” food has become very expensive and if one wants to eat healthy, 9 times out of 10 the produce are old and of poor quality but or in a can or in a bag that’s frozen. But hey, it is what it is.

          • ienvan

            That is exactly how I grew up. It makes me laugh to see kale elevated to cult status. We ate it frequently as a traditional winter food, mashed with potatoes and with a tiny piece of smoked sausage.

          • Andrea

            We poor Americans grow it in our gardens lots of it cause it’s easy and delicious!

          • Powerlurker

            It’s not the kale, per se, it’s the constant intake of kale or whatever “superfood of the month” in smoothie or juice form.

          • Mei Valenzuela

            Exactly!!! So why did you interject your political gibberish into this thread that is about kale ?!

          • progressivevoices

            What does a troll have to do with an article about Kale?

          • Kevin Stowell

            What does your opinion have to do with reality?

        • tdhurst

          The answer to your first question is yes, yes he is.

        • hereatpsu

          Why don’t you read the article again. it talks about the president and his family eating kale and I’m sure quite a few of the followers at least increased their kale intake after reading about the president’s salad after thanksgiving..

          • Kenbo

            Wouldn’t it be great, if the President of the United States stopped SMOKING? Eating kale won’t undo that…

          • elliefrost

            I believe he has and even if he hasn’t, it has nothing to do with his presidency. Many of us have personal little vices of one sort or another and make some poor personal health choices at times.

          • terryinindy

            Apparently you don’t read much, he quit over a year ago.

          • Kenbo

            Awesome! A short 5 years into his Presidency! Don’t know how I missed that. So, no more of those pics of him sneaking cigarettes?
            I’ll choose to believe it, with reservations. It was a pretty well-kept secret during his original campaign. Despite that, he still couldn’t kick the habit..

          • progressivevoices

            Only a cardboard president, like Romney would have been, is vice free… unless you count greed as a vice…

          • Kevin Stowell

            Success is not greed but wealth distribution encourages covetousness and greed, KKKretin.

          • FifeAndDrum

            Speaking of cardboard…

            “Youth participation low in early Obamacare enrollment”


            (Reuters) – The new private health plans available under Obamacare drew in fewer young and healthy Americans than needed for the administration to make healthcare reform a market success in the first wave of enrollment, an official report showed on Monday.

            Twenty-four percent of the 2.2 million people who signed up for private coverage between October 1 and December 28 belonged to a target audience of 18- to 34-year-olds, according to the first administration report to provide a demographic breakdown on enrollment in the new plans offered under President Barack Obama’s healthcare law.

            That compares with a target of closer to 38 percent set before the program’s botched October 1 rollout, when administration officials believed that about 2.7 million of a forecast 7 million enrollees for 2014 would be between 18 and 35.

            Younger enrollees tend to be healthy and are needed to help offset the cost of covering older, sicker consumers, because Obamacare prohibits insurers from charging sick people higher rates and limits the cost premium they can assign to older policyholders.

          • FifeAndDrum

            Why should be believe Barry about ANYTHING?

            “Obama lies to UN human rights official about not having smoked in six years”


            President Barack Obama casually lied about his smoking Monday at the United Nations in a hot mic moment. The news quickly went viral, but few commentators have noted that Obama was flagrantly misstating his smoking history.

            The president said he hasn’t had a cigarette “probably six years,” but according to multiple well documented news reports he was still smoking as of at least late 2009 or early 2010.

            “That’s because I’m scared of my wife,” Obama joked to a Maina Kiai, U.N. Special Rapporteur on human rights. Obama brought up the smoking in the conversation asking the official if he still smoked. (Related: Obama quit smoking because he’s afraid of Michelle [VIDEO])

            Despite his claim to having had a cigarette in six years, Obama had one at least as recently as February 2010, according to Dr. Jeffrey Kuhlman, who performed a physical and who was quoted in the New York Times on Feb. 28, 2010.

          • terryinindy

            Whether or not you believe it is of no legitimate consequence or concern. You’re trolling indicates your need for attention is right up there with the crack addicts need for a hit. Guess what I’m about to deprive you of…..

          • Kenbo

            Please don’t Terry!! I might lose respect for you..

          • Charles Rowin

            its true, its in the article. there is a connection after all. hahaha. sorry to hurt your feelings. studies show that people who dont eat meat are reactionary and fly off the handle for no reason.

          • Dave Schiller

            what studies?

          • Charles Rowin

            if youre stupid enough to jump out of an airplane you may be dumb enough to use google.

          • Dave Schiller

            That’s right, avoid the question by hurling insults. Typical ignorant Lib reaction. If I weren’t stupid enough to jump out of planes, you wouldn’t even have the right to post your ignorant drivel. Swine!

          • margieR

            I rarely eat any meat. I eat chicken from my own farm, but not every day. I also eat fish. My mother was a physician and we ate a great variety of foods growing up. Her mantra was “moderation in all things”. That meant we ate kale and spinach, sweet potatoes, regular potatoes, beans and corn, and canned sardines and mackerel, etc., especially while she was in med school, which was very expensive (canned mackerel was cheap, as were sardines).

          • Charles Rowin

            chicken and fish are meat.

          • cmc

            Apparently you do not understand AHA. The point is to give physicians incentives to get their patients healthy quicker. This means educate them on better eating/exercise habitsas opposed to pumping them with uunnecessary drugs. If you are going to throw politics in to a discussion about kale/ eating well, at least undetstand what you ar . Trying to argue. Also, how could you possibly know what our socio-economic status is? You are making some grand assumptions.

          • Jojo Wright

            What followers are you referring to exactly? Greens have always been a staple in ethnic diets.

        • Eric Schmidt

          It has everything to do about the prez and his “progressive” agenda run amuck. How can we expect affordable health insurance that does not discriminate between those who have a “health lifestyle” and those that do not. Look around you, it seems like most are sporting a belly these days, even little kids! Health education is the only effective, long term solution to our health care system. Tax junk foods, prepared foods and candy. No tax on whole foods! PUT DOWN THE FORK!

          • Cheyenne

            Oh right, because NOBODY in the country was fat until Obama became president.


          • Eric Schmidt

            But his health care plan does not address this very important issue.

        • Steve

          In his defense, what does “eating too much of a good thing” have to do with the upper middle class? Obviously the shot at the Obama voter is stupid – but the original poster’s point is good except for the part where he mentions class. Do poor people not latch on to fad diets just as easily? Are the extremely wealthy not as gullible?

          We all do it. This is a discussion about food and bad habits. Not class. PK0702′s comment is stupid, but attributing this kale problem to only the upper middle class is pretty stupid too.

      • HP

        Nothing like vague sarcastic “points” and poor spelling, the modus operandi of the anti-Obama league.

        • Yeah, eff the millenials!!

          Fighting over Obama in the comments of an article about…anything: the modus operandi of the Internet.

          • sisterfunkhaus

            I have a new game where I guess how long it will take some idiot to bring up Obama from articles that aren’t even remotely political. People are so predictable it usually take about 10 comments max before I reach one.

          • Charles Rowin

            i have a new game that confirms most people who comment about people who make obama references, didnt even read the article.

          • hether

            I wonder how dehydrated kale rates? Not quite the same as cooked at high temps.

          • hereatpsu

            Well, the author thought it was cool to tout about the president’s thanksgiving salad etc.. nothing wrong in stating facts.

          • Yeah, eff the millenials!!

            I think that reference is relevant, though. Pictures of the president enjoying a healthy salad are marketing tools by our government to encourage us to eat better (the most cost effective health care plan is preventative, and our gov’t knows that) The author includes that point to escalate the level of surprise that comes with her big reveal: kale isn’t perfect.

          • Charles Rowin

            so true, preventive care is the best care. i wonder why our health care law does not include dental care.

          • Inkspots


          • Paul Brian Bell

            Lucky for you it covers Mental health.

          • Andrea

            True, I think they even have an organic garden at the White House so they don’t have to have GMO veggies. Wonder if there’s a chicken coop at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave too.

        • Paul Brian Bell

          I know how the struggling newspapers can generate income. Charge people for any amount of replies exceeding 3. These folks obsessed with Obama can help save the industry!

          • Charles Rowin

            do you get followed by fake hippies and smoke fake crack in a fake beemer in the fake haight? just wondering. my favorite grateful dead tribute band is the dreadful grapes from arcata.

          • Paul Brian Bell

            I enjoy making people happy by playing them their favorite songs, which in a certain zip code in San Diego, is GD. Never heard of Dreadful Grapes. I will have to check them out.

          • Mary Cummings

            You’re such a positive, healthy person! (eyes rolling)

      • Redmond Jennings

        You’re a genius, PK. But you already knew that.

        • PK0702

          Thanks buddy.

      • Tamara

        shut up. plus, your mom just yelled down to you in your basement that lunch is almost ready. You know how you hate when your food is cold.

        • PK0702

          Oh shut up you’re hurting my feelings.

      • Tyler


        • PK0702


        • Charles Rowin

          Tool rocks and eats meat. good band. thanks for bringing them up.

      • TJW

        For goodness sakes what is wrong with you?

        This article has ZERO to do with Obama and the comment you quote has ZERO to do with Obama. Perhaps something in YOUR diet (cough fox “news” cough) has caused you to catch Obama Derangement Syndrome! There is a cure… Change the channel.

        • Charles Rowin

          proof that you didnt read the article. the percentage of obama in the article is nearer to 4 percent.

          • Mary Cummings

            Just because his name was mentioned, doesn’t automatically mean we’re required to go into all our opinions, upsets, rants and mind farts about Obama. it was an attention getter. And presidents have always been held up as possible “good examples” for healthy eating, non smoking, caring about some cause, being a good person for either moral reasons, or religious preferences or….yada yada yada. That’s the probelm with using that he was MENTIONED in a quick passing comment! It wasn’t even a TEENY TINE focus of the article. it was a topic about health. So many of you-all here are on auto-pilot about hating this group or that group or this pres or that writer, or that guy down the street, or that lady driver or this a-hole or that thing you hate about this person or that president. You took the bate, heard what you wanted, went off on a president hating tangent and haven’t said a WORD about whether the article (which by the way was about health, not presidents) had any worthy value for you or was interesting. Proving once again, that haters and ranters haven’t a thinking ability. Just pull a chain & off they run to the automatic rant. Can we just not be…FOR 1 SECOND FO YOUR LIFE…stop being about politics and GET A LIFE OF YOUR OWN DESIGN!! We have the freedom to rant and hate and judge, but it doesn’t mean we have to GO there every time we read an article or talk to other human beings! How does your thyroid problem respond to some of the advice here?? That’s the HEALTH INFO that’s the focus of the article. Go to a political page to go on & on about your Obama issues! And now we’re going to start in about Fox news, I see!!! How did this all come from cooking kale or not cooking kale!! THINK much??

          • Charles Rowin

            proving once again that obama lovers are windbags. shut up.

        • Nicolae Frederick Ziebell

          what a joke!

        • Nicolae Frederick Ziebell

          You’re very ill informed, TJW, You have no idea what news is, there is nothing on other channels besides Fox news that speaks truth. It is the liberals who are ruining this country, such as Brock Osama. He is not even from here, and he’s not even black. Screw him! Screw you all too.

          • Cheyenne

            The crazy is strong with this one!

          • TJW


      • acupunk

        Of course mentioning Obama in a talk about kale is typical modus operandi of a no nothing conservative. Try and stay on topic.

      • Inkspots

        I got introduced to kale at a local farmstand in my working class neighborhood, run by latino ladies (same folks maintain the community garden). Are they smart! Very big on chard too, although I haven’t acquired a big taste for it as yet, but I will, I will.

      • Scott Geiger

        You’re completely crazy.

      • progressivevoices

        There is no MO of the Obama Voter unless you mean seeking truth and thinking of others.

        • Kevin Stowell

          How Orwellian of you.

      • GypsyAnna

        “Food” – Don’t judge me because I seek knowledge of what I eat! It has nothing to do with my class, political stance, where I live or how much money I make…. I still eat every day!

        Being educated on what I eat does not make me “obsessed”.

        It’s not an obsession to research foods that may have adverse affects on one’s health. It could be considered an obsession of those who consistently practice criticism and judgement others who love FOODOLOGY. The study of food is wise. Especially in a time when the majority of grocery stores provide boxes and packages of so called ingestible substances that are not even real food.

        Not to mention – - It should be common practice to seek knowledge of what you ingest, ESPECIALLY if certain foods can negatively affect your health and/or could potentially decrease the proper function of an organ or other bodily functions.

    • nnyl

      I like it cooked and mixed in with mashed potatoes.

      • Danielle

        Sounds very Dutch.

        • durkkooistra

          Almost.. you need some traditional smoked sausage (rookworst) and gravy.

        • Joyous56

          Mmmm…yes. With chopped hardboiled eggs and vinegar. …and bacon. Haven’t had dutch lettuce….er, dutch kale…in a long time

      • maegan

        I shred spinach and put it into all my mashed potatoes. So delicious.

        • nnyl

          Sometimes I mix kale and spinach. I have window box planters of leafy greens under a grow light so I have fresh all winter.

      • MeganIsHere

        That’s a traditional dish known as colcannon! It is, indeed, delicious.

        • nnyl

          Yes; I figured that must be why I like it, Irish ancestors.

      • StephanieAndDavid

        Mashed potatoes, caramelized onions and cooked kale is a classic Irish dish called cocannon and it’s wonderful.

        • nnyl

          Everything is better with caramelized onions.

        • Mary Johanna

          Have to try that, sounds very tasty.

        • yea buddy

          add anything to mash potatoes and it’s a classic irish dish

      • Andrea

        colcannon! me too.

      • Mary Johanna

        Grew up in Europe eating Kale that was usually harvested and then cooked with a smoked sausage that was made just during the winter/Kale season. I love Kale and am amused by the “healthy folks” who discovered the benefits of eating green vegetables but as it was said in the article we have learned growing up: “It’s the dose that makes a poison”. Some folks just go overboard with anything new thinking it will be their “cure”.

      • Elyse

        Tonight, I wilted in a nice stew with parsnips, heirloom carrots, golden beets and quinoa! Delish! Less is more.

    • C.S. Stone

      I don’t think its an obsession so much as simply accepting that “we should do THIS now” instead of researching the what, why, how and when of what they’re doing. Everything is a fad for some…

      • Elyse

        I agree- why can we not just have an even keel eating lifestyle. That is my goal and missoin- help others get of the dieting roller coasters and calorie counting!

    • Shelly

      I couldn’t agree with you more. Every few months “they” come out with a new “IT” fruit, vegetable, green, oil, etc. Most greens, vegetables, fruits, and the like carry the same minerals/vitamins. Find a few you like and switch them up. No need to go the Himalayans for “the super magnificent’ fruit that the people of the past ate that was so nutritious. They still died, no? Yes, they might not have some of the diseases that plague us today, but they ate ‘well” and are still dead. Everything in moderation. Even that banana cream pie.

    • acupunk

      I love my morning smoothie but I am not “obsessed” with it. It’s easy, it’s delicious, and is way better than a bagel and cream cheese. That and some oatmeal on these cold winter mornings makes for a pretty good breakfast. Also it, offsets some of the more questionable food choices I make during the day. At 51 I am healthier now than I was 10 years ago.

    • Jason Shanaman

      the situation is easily remedied by eating a variety of greens with your smoothies, which by the way is most people who are really health conscious should be doing and most are. there is no need to stop drinking smoothies in the morning. i would be more concerned with a lack of raw vegetables.

    • SusannaCrackling

      You are very wise, or as the young people say, true dat.

    • Jojo Wright

      Sorry, this doesn’t speak volumes on anything that can be tied to a economic class getting sick! There isn’t any statistical data provided. Plain and simple … if you have a thyroid issue, be careful on the levels of kale.

      Why attack a group of people who treat their body as their temple and who spread their intake of vitamins and nutrients equally through out the day? I guess they take the jam out of your donut by describing what a healthy diet is and you realizing that is not what you are following. For myself, there is so much joy in the journey to get to the end healthy product. Shopping, cooking with my son or in groups, swapping recipes, conversations over food, are the joy with eating not the piece of kale!

    • Leah Silver Graves

      I’m not going to stop my smoothies (they are made with things like spinach and cucumber and fruit) but I will keep cooking kale for dinner (I grow it in my garden) but like all things…moderation is key!

  • maraith

    Marie, when I looked up oxalates, it said kale is recommended for those with a tendency toward kidney stones (like me). So I’m not sure it IS oxalates-rich. Sadly, chocolate is…

    • jem

      I think it is the SPINACH family foods such as SWISS CHARD that are high in the oxalates. Kale is in the cabbage family, of course.

  • Marie

    Thank you for this article, as it is a current topic of conversation in our household. I will add, if someone is prone to kidney stones, my understanding is (and I am NOT a physician!) they should moderate their intake of oxalate-rich foods such as kale. Bummer.

    • Paul Terrill

      1.Not all kidney stones contain oxalate, though the most common type do. I echo MamaG123 — they should be talking to their doctor about this. Some kidney stone formers need to avoid uric acid promoting foods or citrate.
      2.RE: Kale — get back in BALANCE folks. If you wind up in a hypothyroid coma, there is going to be more amiss than just your kale consumption, not the least the fact that you’ve been ill for quite some time and either didn’t see a doctor, or they didn’t check some basic blood work.
      3. The sky is not falling.

    • maraith

      Kale is not oxalate-rich. You must mean spinach. Look it up.

      • Marie

        Oh that would be great. Both this family member’s doctor AND everywhere online I seem to look (such as says that it contains oxalates. Let me know where you found that – thanks!

        • Florida Farmer

          There is a difference between “oxalate-rich” and “contains oxalates”. Spinach is at the very high end of the scale, with kale falling toward the bottom – and then the content varies by variety, with the tuscan/dino type kales on the low end of that group, as i understand it – and things like okra, beet and other greens in the middle of them. While I’m no doctor, and don’t even play one on the internet, everything I’ve read has said that people with an otherwise normal, healthy diet and healthy digestive tract shouldn’t be too badly off by eating those dark leafy greens from time to time because the benefits outweigh the potential interference with calcium uptake. Not to the tune of over a kilo a day, raw, for months and months like that woman in the study cited! I can’t even imagine eating 2.5 pounds of greens a day every day for that long. You’d think you’d get tired of it after awhile. I found this that might interest you if you have someone susceptible to kidney stones:

          • Marie

            This is really helpful, thank you. For anyone reading who didn’t click the link, it contains a table of oxalate levels that is helpful. Thank you again!

          • Marie

            My reply didn’t seem to post (so apologies if this shows twice) and wanted to make sure you knew I appreciate your taking the time to reply. This is really helpful to us and for anyone reading – the link takes you to a table of foods and oxalate levels. Thank you so much!

        • maraith

          Actually, Marie, I found contradictory information. But this seems the most legit:

          Oxalates in Kale

          According to nutrient data provided by the U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA), 100-gram serving of kale (Brassica oleracea L. var. acephala) contains only 20 milligrams of oxalates. This translates into about 13 milligrams per one cup of chopped kale. And this may even be an overstatement: According to data provided by the Department of Nutrition at the Harvard School of Public Health, a cup of chopped kale contains merely 2 milligrams of oxalates! The websites that claim that kale is rich in oxalates do not usually provide actual values for oxalate-containing foods, nor do they state the source of their information. In the light of all this evidence, the claim that raw kale is rich in oxalates appears to be nothing but a myth.

          Oxalic Acid in Spinach

          While kale is low in oxalates, spinach (Spinacia oleracea) is indeed a significant source of oxalates. On an ounce-to-ounce basis, only a few foods contain more oxalates than raw spinach (these foods include parsley, chives, purslane, cassava and amaranth, all of which have been reported to contain over 1 gram of oxalic acid per a 100-gram serving). According to USDA data, a 100-gram portion of spinach provides a whopping 970 milligrams of oxalic acid! And according to the Harvard data, the oxalate content of spinach may be even higher.

          If you’re looking for ways to reduce oxalic acid in your diet but love the health benefits (not to mention the culinary value!) of fresh spinach, you may want to focus on cooking with spinach in fall rather than spring or summer. According to a 2006 study published in HortScience, a bi-monthly publication of the American Society for Horticultural Science, the concentration of oxalic acid in spinach was lowest in fall.

          • Marie

            This is helpful – thank you!

  • Jennifer Staton

    In response to Judy’s concern. I’m a Nurse Practitioner and I agree this particular food/drug interaction was not mentioned in my education nor do I hear providers discussing it. However, if you’re on thyroid replacement hormones and you maintain a relatively consistent intake of the foods mentioned above, you can assume that your dose has already been adjusted to accommodate your intake (unless you ate none during the dose titration phase). If you make significant and persistent changes in your intake of these foods, ask to have your TSH checked a couple months after making the change; the Synthroid dose is adjusted in response to changes in TSH. Let me know if this isn’t clear or you have questions.

    • Virginia Sowell

      Thank you, Jennifer. That’s exactly right!

    • Lois Munchel

      Hi Jennifer, I’m a vegetarian who also takes Synthroid. My thyroid caused me havic 40 yrs. ago, thyroid thyrotoxicosis. I had goiter and graves disease. I love my vegetables, especially all that are listed as not good for me. I wonder since my thyroid was destroyed by radioactive iodine, do the same issues affect me? I just can’t do without my kale, spinach, etc. I appreciate your opinion.

      • Danielle DuBois Gottwig

        Lois, I had grave’s too – and no longer have a thyroid at all. I don’t think vegetable consumption is going to matter much to us. But the most it would do is push your need or supplement one way or the other just a bit. But that is OK, as long as we are consistent enough that the dosage we are on is working for us. We can’t exactly harm or revive the operations of a gland that no longer exists.

        • Lois Munchel

          thank you Danielle now I can go eat the kale in my fridge and not worry

      • Jennifer Staton

        Hi Lois,

        It doesn’t matter WHY your thyroid is currently underfunctioning, whether due to gland ablation to treat Graves as you had, or just garden variety low function. As long as your thyroid levels on your current dose of Synthroid (or generic) are within target, the medication dose is adequate to compensate for any anti-thyroid effects of the foods you eat. I’m on Levothyroxine for post-partum hypothyroidism and I eat plenty of the offending foods. I don’t juice them, though, that might be overkill :). Good for you for having a healthy diet!. What was your last TSH ?


        • Lois Munchel

          thank you Jen, I do have my TSH checked often since medication I take makes it screwy.

          • Jennifer Staton

            Why does the medicine make it screwy ? You should be able to get to a stable dose and resulting pretty stable TSH (unless the iodine ablation was recent and you’re still stabilizing….) This is totally manageable, don’t let the vegetable article stress you out :)

          • Lois Munchel

            Sorry Jen, it’s meds for Pulmonary Hypertension. A progressive disease that only two in a million get. It affects your heart and lungs. That is why i have to get TSH checked more often than normal. Thanks for your concern.

          • Vlad

            I know this thread is old, but I cringe every time I see someone say “get your TSH checked.” TSH is an outdated way of looking at healthy thyroid function (it doesn’t even measure actual thyroid function!) and while it might be an indicator that things are gone bad, I wish the medical community would quit insisting that a stable TSH indicates healthy or good results. It doesn’t necessarily work both ways. It was because of my (and my mother’s, and my friend’s, and…and…) “good” TSH readings that doctors initially refused to believe my (and their) problems were thyroid-related. Turns out, I (and they) have Hashimoto’s Disease, hypothyroidism, and thyroid cancer, even with “good” TSH levels. Because of those TSH tests, we spent an unnecessary amount of time feeling sick and fatigued. And too many people spend too much time feeling bad on thyroid meds because of good T4 results, too. Good T4
            doesn’t mean your body is converting T3.

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      • StellarStella

        Hi Lois –
        I just want to share with you that during 15 yrs on Synthroid, I was NEVER able to get steady or much better. Turns out that Synthroid has a really loose mfg process (unlike say, a mfg company like ISO procedures that have certain requirements each and every time) and you actually get quite a varied amount of actual thyroid meds with each pill. When I was changed to new medication, it only took a few months to get stable.
        The best medication I ever used was Unithroid – I felt like a million bucks while taking it. But after losing my job and insurance, I had to go back to generic levothyroxin. :-(

        But, moving to a new state and starting with a new dr was a nightmare! I am still trying to get stabilized! Ugh….
        If Unithroid is still available, I hope you’ll consider it – might work for you too!

        • Lois Munchel

          thanks Stellar Stella I will mention this to my dr.

        • Judith Broome

          You might want to go with brand v. Generic. My dr. Insists on brand for thyroid meds. Also, I understand levothyroxine has bee n taken off the market.

          • Diane

            is that true? I have been taking Levothyroxine for as long as I can remember! and im taking it now.. what is the reason for taking it off? do you know? I was hoping that my doc would try something like Unithroid or Armor as I have heard so many people happy with the results! my doctor is Indian and not good at making changes! he has NEVER told me I cant eat certain Veggies.. I learn all this on the internet. I am in my 50′s and still find out something new every darn day! I am with Tricare and its tough to get anything new in their pharmacy!!!!!! not sure what to do to convince change! I feel like crap all the time! my body is aching as I type this.. and I have been gaining weight lately without increasing my intake of fact.. I have been off sugar and white breads rice..etc.. because I was diagnosed with type 2 diabetes! ok..yep im falling apart! also have high blood pressure which has been in the normal zone on meds..and lower intake of salt.. I just don’t know which way to turn anymore.. its all so confusing! :)

          • Kathy

            have you had your iodine levels checked…it’s not true that we don’t have deficiencies here in the States…it’s worse now than ever!! Iodine used to be in the bread now it’s bromine and lots of the crap we ingest (like fluoride in the water that actually concentrates as you cook with it) takes the place of iodine in our system so the body is faked into thinking it has iodine when it doesn’t! I’ve been doing a TON of research on Hypothyroidism because my teenage Son was diagnosed with it 3 yrs ago (TSH 150) and is still HORRIBLY sick….I’m sick of relying on the Doc because he’s not helping my Son. I just found out that his is an Autoimmune (Hashimoto’s) type which is a beast of a different color than “regular” Hypo but iodine is very important for Thyroid, especially in Hypo patients so get it checked then do some research about supplementing with iodine (most protocols call for adding selenium, B2 & B3. Vit C, magnesium and a few other things when supplementing with iodine) also have your D levels checked…low D is becoming an epidemic as well!

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            At $87hr to make that much in a month, she has to work just over 11 hours a day, Monday thru Friday. Or she can just work every single day for nearly 8 hrs a day – never taking a day off. That’s not what I would consider “just a few hours”.

          • Susanwd

            Levoxyl is the brand name drug taken off the market. Levothyroxine is a generic version, and is still available.

      • hereatpsu

        hmm.. is that your real last name? Kinda interesting to see it on a kale (or any leaf related) post!

        • Lois Munchel

          yep! and my members of my family’s nicknames are “Munch”.

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    • Nora Kirkwood Dunagan

      Hello Jennifer. I take synthroid 150 mcg. I am 53 and have been taking it for 24 years. My levels have changed some over the years. Last year we saw the movie Fat, Sick and Nearly Dead; we were over weight. I used our Vitamix and lost 30 pounds using it in the morning and lunch. :) My question is, I put in kale-one leaf, handful of spinich, a carrot, apple, strawberries, Orange, honey and blueberries; can that effect my tsh levels? I do get it checked often. Thanks for your time.

      • Jennifer Staton

        Hi Nora, I think you should be fine. If your synthroid dose was too low to compensate for your diet you would start to have signs of under-active thyroid (increased fatigue, cold intolerance, constipation, maybe depressed mood) and your TSH would have gotten higher. Congratulations on the positive changes!!

    • Angie Molinario Parker

      I have the opposite – I have an overactive thyroid (Graves) – Can I drink a smoothie that has kale in it on a daily basis or not?

    • sue

      I think the point is that people are given the impression that eating healthy foods such as broccoli, brussel sprouts, cabbage, cauliflower, collard greens, kohlrabi, mustard, rutabaga, turnips, bok choy and Chinese cabbage. Arugula, horseradish, radish, wasabi and watercress and soy have no ramifications such as hypothyroidism. What many people don’t realize that they can have normal thyroid levels for a long time ,even though they might have symptoms of a low thyroid.Why? Thyroid levels can be erratic ranging from normal to low like a roller coaster,the low levels actually have to be “caught”. It can be very upsetting to people when they are eating soy and cruciferous vegetables,no junk and exercising yet the doctor may dismiss this and assume the person is eating junk food! My point is if you are having low thyroid symptoms continue to get thyroid levels checked at intervals.In my case eating soy and broccoli in my diet finally my TSH was 14 after years of “normal” readings even though I had the symptoms of hypothyrodism!

  • Judy D

    I have to wonder how many doctors are even aware of these risks and how to manage them. I have been on thyroid medication for several years now, and not once has anyone brought this issue up. I recall reading in the fine print literature that came with the medication that I should avoid walnuts and several other foods I don’t recall (because I didn’t eat often!)…when I asked the doctor about it she was not aware of this. I can’t help but think about all the spinach and almonds I ate yesterday! I had heard about selenium being good to help maintain thyroid health, and was consuming a few brazil nuts each day…don’t love them. Guess I will need to go back to adding them in. And have another conversation the next visit with my doctor.

    • healthnut

      ok I need help here-I ate kale cooked with other veggies for the past 8 months and now I have a benign thyroid nodule. the doctor said it wont go away-any thoughts

      • MammaG123

        Go back to the doctor and ask her about it. Strangers on the internet are NOT a good source of medical advice.

        • eyecolts

          And most physicians are not good sources of nutrition information. Nutrition is not covered extensively in medical education. Try to get a referral to a licensed dietitian.

          • Sunitha Perk

            My doctor still takes the methotrexate (horrible drug) he prescribed me. However, I don’t take those pills anymore because going vegan and using cannabis solved my issues with severe arthritis (I couldn’t even walk). Now I can run daily if I want and I wasn’t in remission when I quit the pills. He still takes the pills even though I told him how to get off them. Dumb!

            Why your post doesn’t receive more likes is surprising since you’re the one who’s correct. People need to understand the requirements for doctors are 25 hours of nutritional training and I think its something like 33% of medical colleges don’t even require the standard 25. Point is, get a good dietitian like you said or better yet, like me, educate yourself daily. I’m never done with my studies. Every day for 15 minutes minimum. Been a year and I’m very knowledgable.

        • Molly Hosack

          ^voice of reason^

      • nuitgoddess

        See if you can find a Functional Medicine doctor. Google it for your state.

    • Lloyd

      you are far more danger from any soy product than kale, soy is well known for its damage to the thyroid

      • MammaG123

        Citation needed.

        • Tupelo

          I’ve known this for years, but the difference is whether it is fermented or not:

          • nuitgoddess

            Or GMO’d

        • Yarnoven

          Soy *IS* known to inhibit absorption of medication when you are taking it, and if you already have a thyroid problem, it could cause some problems, since it is much like Kale a goitergenic and too much soy, as with anything, can absolutely be a bad thing. This has been been proven numerous times.

        • Lloyd

          get a grip i have given you the lead now go google the dangers of soy, nothing about soy is good unless it is fermented and even then moderation is needed

          • John Santos

            If you have no evidence, just say so. If you make a claim, you can’t just tell other people to prove it. The burden of proof is on you, not on MammaG123.

          • Lloyd

            she questioned it i gave her where to go to find out, learn to read, but for you here it is; Thousands of studies link soy to malnutrition, digestive distress, immune system breakdown, thyroid dysfunction, cognitive decline, reproductive disorders and infertility — even cancer and heart disease.


          • John Santos

            You posted this link *NOW*, but only after I asked. BTW, Mercola is an infamous quack.

          • Lloyd

            the quack is the idiot that wrote this story on kale..thousands of studies on soy have all returned the same results , it is a poison and soy oil is the worst because it is hydrogenated, if you dont know what that means i suggest you ask friend google, btw saying go to google and look at dangers of soy is the link as i dont have the time nor the inclination to post the many hundreds of links that have come to the same conclusion,,, its poison

      • Judy D

        Don’t eat soy at all